Show of HandsShow of Hands

Show Of Hands June 30th, 2013 1:50am

Are you in favor of Federal funding of embryonic stem-cell research?

156 Liked

Comments: Add Comment

satiricalnick meh
06/29/13 7:58 pm

Kill one to save another. The ends do justify the means. Thanks machiavelli.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:58 pm

Kill one? Huh?

fettuchini Not in a free state
06/29/13 7:55 pm

I'm against most nonessential government spending.

Remember the good ol days when universities, corporations and private donors funded research products?

Reply
RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:57 pm

Uh, no.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 8:02 pm

That's because we weren't born then. The National Cancer Institute began in 1937, Center for Scientific Review 1946. (OK, I was born that year.) But the roots really go back at least to the 1870s when congress budgeted the National Board of Health.

dudley northern Virginia woods
06/29/13 7:54 pm

Oh let the capitalist system handle it.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:55 pm

It is.

r3VOLution not of this world
06/29/13 8:05 pm

Then we don't need the government to fund it.

gjb2779
06/29/13 7:52 pm

I think stem cells have some amazing powers for healing but we need to create clear and strict laws on their use. That part could be tricky

gjb2779
06/29/13 7:50 pm

Dear Susanr - CHILL THE F OUT about the SOH 2.1 update. Holy crap, we can check our app store notifications for ourselves. CHILL with the billion comments about it

Reply
RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:51 pm

Sounds like you need to chill the fck out, snivel btch.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:52 pm

Dork.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 7:54 pm

Hi to you too. I realize it looks a tad obnoxious, but I'm taking to people who are stuck in 2.0-land. They're seeing only 3-4 comments in each of the SOH polls. I'm willing to help them get updated, if that doesn't put you out too much.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 7:55 pm

And this is the only way I can get a message to them.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:56 pm

Susan, you don't owe this turd sandwich an explanation.

rolltribe Ohio
06/29/13 7:58 pm

Just ignore him Susan, you're helping people, there's nothing wrong with that

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 8:04 pm

Yeah but I understand it does look a little obnoxious, if you don't realize the 2.0 people aren't seeing any of these messages - or any 2.1-user-created polls at all.

ScrewU Gone
06/30/13 5:46 am

2.1 froze up on me. I had to delete and reinstall. Anyone else have problems?

Steve6453 Michigan
06/30/13 1:23 pm

I think he ment it as kind of a joke not to be mean. I thought it was kinda funny too and rj i think she seems like she can handle herself and without the childish name calling

gjb2779
06/30/13 1:54 pm

Thank you Steve, and yes I meant it in jest as a because I'd seen the comment EVERYWHERE & obviously she isn't Tony so I found it odd. But yes thank you RJ for flipping out and jumping into an argument you weren't involved in to namecall Very classy.

gjb2779
06/30/13 1:57 pm

@susanr I wasn't trying to attack you or anything, I was just giving you a tough time . If I offended you I'm sorry, I like to horse around and the general climate here tends to be people taking digs at each other. No malic intended.

gjb2779
06/30/13 1:59 pm

Now then I'm heading back out to my rare & beautiful mid 80s summer day in KC. First time in forever it isn't blistering hot out, outdoor workout machines @ volker park here I come. Woot woot!

susanr Colorado
06/30/13 4:09 pm

gjb - I truly don't understand how that was supposed to be a joke. It sounded royally pissed, to me. And "billions" of messages I posted consisted of exactly 10 total in 4 polls - only 2 in this one. If I can help a few people, it's worth it, to me.

rlands
06/29/13 7:50 pm

I like how 7 of the top 8 comments are RJ's. And the top comment is about him.

Reply
RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:52 pm

It's how I roll.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 7:57 pm

Because he knows what the hell he's doing. I'm so glad he's here.

rlands
06/29/13 7:57 pm

I would expect nothing less!

Fjolsvin Midgard
06/29/13 7:50 pm

If it isn't specifically called for in the constitution the government has no business doing it. I hate the fact that a nameless gov official is able to point the gun of the government at me demand money and spend it at will

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thatguy81 here
06/29/13 8:00 pm

Fight back or shut the fuck up.

All you sound like is a pissed off teenage girl who can't go to the mall.

rlands
06/29/13 8:03 pm

"If it isn't specifically called for in the constitution" the govt shouldn't do it? Interesting philosophy. Would you prefer the states take over?

praetorianus65
06/29/13 7:49 pm

I'm always in favor of funding for research, no matter the source.

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:51 pm

Or price apparently

TomM
06/29/13 7:52 pm

If it is such a good idea, why don't you put your own money in.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:54 pm

We do. We invest our lives in it, btw.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:55 pm

Have you RJ

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:58 pm

I am I biotech. I work for a company that is on the fore-front of non-embryonic stem cell research. I invest in my work, as well as in companies that do this type of work.

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 4:14 am

Congrats, thank you for your investment.

commonsense America isnt racist
06/29/13 7:47 pm

It's one of the things I actually want the govt to spend money on.

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SugarShaq
06/29/13 7:44 pm

Why must everything be "federally funded."

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TomM
06/29/13 7:50 pm

Because no one would would spend their own money on it. Only way they can get this funded is to spend our money.

ModerateGOP26 Maine
06/29/13 8:14 pm

Exactly ... They're not in a position to add expenditures. Period.

fredd TrumpLand
06/29/13 11:36 pm

Because thanks to the "perfection" of the market, private companies rarely invest when there isn't a clear chance for a R.O.I.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/29/13 7:44 pm

It seems like promising science. I'm in favor of spending our government money on any research that might make our lives better, but that might not offer an investor a clear path to profit and would therefore never be funded by the private sector.

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TomM
06/29/13 7:44 pm

You mean spending our money. Those of us who pay the taxes.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:45 pm

I know Tomm, we have it soooo bad here. So unreasonable.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/29/13 8:03 pm

I pay taxes, that's why I called it "our" government money. It's the kind of thing I pay taxes for.

TomM
06/29/13 9:03 pm

Zod, I didn't mean to imply you're not paying taxes. It was just meant to say it is our tax money they are spending on something I don't want.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/29/13 9:45 pm

No, I know TomM, I was just saying that of all the things we might spend tax money on, research, and especially medical research, is something I DO want my tax money spent on. Since we disagree, what if we spend some, but not all of it on this?

TomM
06/29/13 9:54 pm

Compromise, how can I say no to that.... But spending more money is hard for me.
I do think research is very important. I work for a company that spends hundreds of millions on research annually. This is the way I think it should work. The federal...

TomM
06/29/13 9:57 pm

...government can make attractive rules and regulations, such as an effective patent administration. However, this shouldn't cost the tax payers anything, fees can fund it. There's so much which I find more important than stem cell research.

TomM
06/29/13 10:00 pm

I find the government deficits and debt alarming and I want our focus to be on fixing the economy.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/29/13 10:03 pm

That makes sense TomM, but it remains true than a lot of research has inestimable value to us as a society but has no real potential for profit, and therefore just won't attract private resources. Medicine for example shouldn't be profitable.

TomM
06/29/13 10:20 pm

I agree not all research has profit potential, my example would be the environment, there I am ready to fund through taxes.
Medicine shouldn't be profitable? Would you want all medical research to be funded by taxes?

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/29/13 10:52 pm

I think medicine in general ought to be run or funded by the government and non-profits. That's a separate issue. A lot of research in many diverse fields is made possible by government grants. I'd expand that in all fields - a lot.

fredd TrumpLand
06/29/13 11:39 pm

Zod basically said what I think, but more concisely and elegantly than I could phrase it. Thanks Zod!

TomM
06/29/13 11:55 pm

As you can probably guess I cannot support that, but I'm interested in why you think it should be tax payer funded?

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/30/13 7:29 am

TomM I think medicine in general should be treated as the furtherance in one of the three intrinsic rights, life, and should be available to all, equally. It isn't free, obviously, but I think pooling our resources is the best way to reach the goal.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
06/30/13 7:33 am

Likewise, research in general adds to our knowledge as a group and should not be limited to those few things that appear profitable, but should include everything knowable. It benefits us all and should be paid for by us all.

TomLaney1 Jesus is Lord
06/29/13 7:41 pm

NO NO NO - Adult stem cells or umbilical cord blood cells only. These are the only ones that show any promise anyway. But unborn humans should not be treated like animal carcasses.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:42 pm

Wrong.

ThePhlegm The Lone Star State
06/29/13 7:55 pm

Rjs well thought out argument aside, he is correct that unborn humans are not treated as carcasses to get the stem cells. No babies or possible babies or aborted babies are hurt getting them....
But I do think adult stem cells have shown more promise

TomLaney1 Jesus is Lord
06/29/13 7:59 pm

@ thephlegm - Thanks for the more intelligent reply. I'll read up some more.

kateXcore Dark side of the moon
06/29/13 7:40 pm

Absolutely not, my tax dollars should not be going toward this.

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:41 pm

Thank you a voice of reason finally

TomM
06/29/13 7:42 pm

+1

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:43 pm

Your whopping contribution? What should your tax dollars be going toward, in your opinion?

TomM
06/29/13 7:46 pm

When the debt has been paid, any additional funds (not likely there's any) should be paid back to those who paid.

natedog1
06/29/13 7:40 pm

Giving the government more control sound like a great idea!!!

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susanr Colorado
06/29/13 7:42 pm

Hi - do you know there's an SOH 2.1 update available?

susanr Colorado
07/01/13 3:31 pm

What "spam posts"?

It's a necessary upgrade. Scroll down the poll list to find a message from Tony about it a few days ago, & also read a recent blog post (June 28).

susanr Colorado
07/01/13 3:34 pm

What "spam posts"?

It's a necessary upgrade. Scroll down the poll list to find a message from Tony about it a few days ago, & also read a recent blog post (June 28).

EarlyBird Portland
06/29/13 7:40 pm

God, I've missed you ❤

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:43 pm

Luv you EB!

bfriend
06/29/13 7:36 pm

I'd rather have the government spend it on cell research than some other useless thing.

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theNobamist Silicon Valley
07/01/13 2:51 pm

Like a hundred million dollar vacation.

Pragmaniac Hipsterville
06/29/13 7:27 pm

Better than private funding. I shudder to think where corporations would take it.

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:36 pm

Where could they take it, what's the worst thing they could do with stem cells, take your tin foil hat off.

SugarShaq
06/29/13 7:45 pm

Private individuals and claimed have invented most of the cures we have, not government.

palindrome California
06/29/13 7:48 pm

... Are you sure about that? Because I'm pretty sure private corps WITH federal funding may have done this, but not entirely private entities.

What I DO know is that private corporations sure have found ways to "treat" symptoms... Usually with side-effects way worse than the original illness

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:50 pm

Palin: links please

palindrome California
06/29/13 11:12 pm

Links to what? I haven't made a claim. But I would like to see links to support the claim that private entities have come up with most cures

palindrome California
06/29/13 11:19 pm

I just did a basic search and found that government research and contributed IMMENSELY more to our society than private and most private research breakthroughs ride off the work done by governmental research: Human Genome Project, the Internet,

palindrome California
06/30/13 4:49 am

I don't have any links. Why should I provide links? I didn't make the claim that private was better than public funding.

Uhh, but just off the top of my head,
-Human Genome Project and all the subsequent findings
-The Internet
- NASA and all the

palindrome California
06/30/13 4:51 am

the technology that was taken from NASA and defense technology and adapted for commercial use : microwaves, sonograms, I mean the list can go on to write a book.

But let's hear some links proving the contrary

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 5:13 am

You did "private corporations sure have found ways to "treat" symptoms...
Usually with side-effects way worse than the original illness"

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 5:27 am

The burden of proof rests with the original asserter.

ScrewU Gone
06/30/13 5:47 am

What's the big deal about a little anal leakage?

palindrome California
06/30/13 5:49 am

Oh, that's why you need leaks to. I'm going off what I see in the commercials for anti-depressant medication. Anti-allergen medication, the medication that treats high blood pressure, blood clots, high cholesterol.... Even medication for erections!

palindrome California
06/30/13 5:52 am

Wow. I'm watching a commercial as we TYPE for a drug called "Xarelto"-- didn't catch what it treated but my God, "side effects may include uncontrollable bleeding which may rarely lead to death"?!

I suppose I should take another treatment for that?

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 6:55 am

So you're saying that because medicine can have side effects that government is god?? I don't understand that formula. You do realize side effects are rare right? and you do realize government medication can also have side effects right??

palindrome California
06/30/13 7:56 am

Uhh, please quote me where I said ANY if that

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 8:02 am

Palin: what you're saying is that corporate healthcare is bad because it has side effects. The facts are that government healthcare can also have side effects, it's not just a corporate thing. Side effects have no relevance to this conversation.

palindrome California
06/30/13 8:13 am

I NEVER said ANY of that. Go home. You're just making up BS

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 8:22 am

Jokes on you I am home.
"Wow. I'm watching a commercial as we TYPE for a drug called "Xarelto"-- didn't catch what it treated but my God, "side effects may include uncontrollable bleeding which may rarely lead to death"?!"
What did you mean then?

palindrome California
06/30/13 8:41 am

I'm talking about the horrible side-effects a lot of these pharmaceutical drugs have and they don't even cure anything. They only treat them. Idk why you decided to jump in. But that was a response to the original comment about how private companies

palindrome California
06/30/13 8:43 am

have found most of the cures, not government..

*not the original comment. The comment by liberty

TomM
06/29/13 7:24 pm

Please read the question. The question is whether the federal government should fund it. Not whether it should be allowed.

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:21 pm

This is silly, private organizations can fund this just as well as the Feds can, there is no reason to be wasting funds on this when they can do it as well or better than the Feds.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:24 pm

No they can't.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:25 pm

Private organizations could have put a man on the moon too, right? Did they? Have they yet?

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:26 pm

SpaceX has made remarkable progress in space, also a Dutch company is planning a trip to Mars
applicants.mars-one.com/

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:28 pm

Yeah, uh....how many years since then? Great call!

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:28 pm

You would be surprised the funds private organizations can pull together.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:28 pm

Since when SpaceX? About zero.

duey in a fools paradise
06/29/13 7:21 pm

Yeah I'm for it and women should drink their placenta after birth as well. Anything to help those in need. Just kidding about the placenta thing I just read something about January Jones drank hers because we are the only mammals that don't.

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14573 Scary Numbers
06/29/13 7:22 pm

Wha... I don't even....

duey in a fools paradise
06/29/13 8:07 pm

Yeah......I know I guess sometimes just like to add something so stupid that it will cause someone to put a link to youtube up, sorry!

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:19 pm

Ok, from this time forth....

As of now, there is no proper substitution for embryonic stem cells, for most applications. We are working to change that. Until then, it is the technology.

Embryonic stem cells can save lives. Period.

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Arkansas123 Neoconservative
06/29/13 7:20 pm

And adult stem cells HAVE saved lives.

14573 Scary Numbers
06/29/13 7:21 pm

We can rebuild you, we have the technology.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:24 pm

Arkansas, yes they have. The company I work for is a major reason for that.

What I say stands.

chance Sirnotappearinginthisfilm
06/29/13 7:30 pm

Well aren't you special. I agree with your premise about stem cells, however the Feds have no business spending our money on it. If you think they can do it better than the private sector, you are delusional.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:34 pm

Ok chance. Ok. They have no business running our country, which is what they are supposed to do. You've nailed it.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:35 pm

Yes. RJ is delusional.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:36 pm

Yes. So very, very delusional.

thejoker Call me Bartholomew
06/29/13 7:19 pm

At this point if the government wants to spend any money they need to ask China's permission first.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:20 pm

Yeah, good one.

Uh, what's the Yuan pegged to again? Oh yeah, the dollar. That's right.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:23 pm

Apples net worth is more than what we owe china.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:27 pm

Wait, what we owe china? We don't owe china anything. They invest in us. They choose to buy our bonds, just like the rest of the world. Why? They can make money off of the world's #1 economy.

chance Sirnotappearinginthisfilm
06/29/13 7:32 pm

Rj, try to pay attention you twit. China buys our debt, they can, at anytime call those bonds, of they do that. We are screwed.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:35 pm

Bwaaaahahaha!

Oh, wow! You are totally in la-la land, aren't you?!

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:37 pm

The yuan is not "pegged" to any, RJ. It is fiat currency, as is the dollar.

I know you can insist from this day forward it is whatever you decree..... You still have no effect on reality.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:44 pm

Oh really? It's not pegged to the dollar, huh? So, the currency of a communist country is held in high regard, huh. How is that possible?

I can't wait to hear this nugget of insight.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:51 pm

RJ, why don't you link us to a site which explains the current agreement between the US and China pegging the Yuan at a set ratio to the US dollar? Do you not see how foolish you look?

rlands
06/29/13 7:56 pm

I don't think there's a single currency that wouldn't change if the dollar went down, honestly. But RJ does have merit with the private entity thing. The only way we could get companies to do adequate research is if we allowed them patents.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 8:01 pm

Roland's, Private entities are already doing research and will patent any results they get. That is why there is no need for any Federal tax dollars to be granted for research.

thatguy81 here
06/29/13 8:04 pm

WTF could china possibly do if they called in on our debt?

Not a fucking thing. We can tell them to fuck off and nothing would happen.

rlands
06/29/13 8:13 pm

Evo- then we're going to get a ridiculous amount of complaints for patenting medical technology and such, and having the government control it will practically guarantee adequate funds.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 8:33 pm

rlands, not sure what you are saying. Are you indicating complaints will result from private companies having all the patents related to stem cell treatments?

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 8:36 pm

rlands, the question was whether Federal funding should be granted to embryonic stem cell research. I have no issues with funding for other forms of stem cell research.

rlands
06/29/13 8:38 pm

Ok I don't think I was understanding you. Gotcha. Makes sense.

Blarney Wrightville
06/29/13 7:18 pm

Yes, this will be a heated discussion, but refrain from "I'll get the pop corn" jokes tonight please!!!

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chance Sirnotappearinginthisfilm
06/29/13 7:32 pm

So, no popcorn then?

14573 Scary Numbers
06/29/13 7:18 pm

I have type 1 diabetes. Stem cell research is my best chance for a cure. So yes, I do support it.

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evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:24 pm

Odd... Both U.S. News and Science Daily reported a possible cure for Type 1 through the use of adult stem cells (from bone marrow) with an existing drug. Many advancements from adult stem cells over the last few years.

ari11235
06/29/13 7:17 pm

It seems like an obvious decision. We can use stem cells to regrow tissues and save lives of people who are already alive. If you think we should save what isn't really alive yet and let someone else die then you need to re evaluate your priorities.

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TomM
06/29/13 7:21 pm

The question really was whether the federal government should fund it. That makes a difference to some of us.

hvp828 Carolina girl
06/29/13 7:39 pm

A 6-week embryo shows brain activity & a heart beat. So I'm not sure how you could say it really isn't alive. At any rate, it may seem like an obvious decision to you & i'll respect your opinion, but I'm pretty sure I don't need to reevaluate my priorities.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 7:43 pm

Hi - do you know there's an SOH 2.1 update available?

ari11235
06/29/13 7:51 pm

@hvp well yes, but should we focus on letting that live rather than somebody who has friends, family, etc?

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 8:18 pm

hvp - Embryonic stems cells are not made from 6-week embryos. They CANNOT be. They are made from a very early embryo 4-5 days after fertilization containing 50-150 cells. There is no brain, no heart, no organized tissues AT ALL. They are UNDIFFERENTIATED cells.

palindrome California
06/29/13 8:34 pm

^^ which is why they're stem cells lol it always gets me how uneducated people get fooled into thinking it's harvesting a life embryo for its cells. That's not it at all. If it were a living embryo, the cells would be useless. These are blank cells... At this point they could be turned into anything

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 8:48 pm

Hey, palindrome, do you know there's a 2.1 update available? It doesn't look as if you've updated yet. (Nobody's replied to my other messages, but I'll make a special effort to get to you.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 8:50 pm

I'm not sure why there's that misconception. Maybe it's what people are being told in some of the less-than-forthright places. I know SOME of these concepts are difficult (like the 3-parent child), but this one - not quite so much.

palindrome California
06/29/13 9:58 pm

What's the benefit of the new update?

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:04 pm

There are some nice new features, like an in-app notification center that holds 50 notifications & works better than the Apple notifications. A set of poll filters so you can see ALL, just NEW (unanswered) or MINE (your own) polls. But more importantly, the update points to the new servers...

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:06 pm

and 2.0 DOESN'T, so you're seeing very little of the action. There are actually 311 comments here; you're probably seeing about 26. People on 2.1 can see your comments, but you can't see theirs. The update also brings back Android users (who were pointed at the new servers first)...

praetorianus65
06/29/13 10:07 pm

If I were religious, I'd pray we get at least ONE day on SoH where nobody mentions either abortion or gay rights.
It's been debated to death.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:09 pm

and there's a web version (which actually you could get to with a browser at w.showofhands.mobi/polls/). More importantly, Tony says the update is MANDATORY. See his message down the poll list a ways, & also read the current blog entry.

palindrome California
06/29/13 10:10 pm

Oh those are all pretty neat. No wonder I only see a few comments.... It's quiet here.. I kinda like it

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:10 pm

Well, you know, that ain't gonna happen. Either one. One could try to ignore those polls... I ignore the abortion ones pretty much, but I do get into the homosexuality ones, until I can't take it any more.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:12 pm

Yeah, I know. I've been looking at the SOH polls with 2.0 on the iPad, where it's eerily quiet, and with 2.1 on the iPhone, where it's... normal. But really, I don't know how long 2.0 will be viable, plus NO ONE CAN TALK TO YOU! Except me, because I'm taking in 2.0. And a few others maybe.

susanr Colorado
06/29/13 10:14 pm

Everyone in 2.1 can see these messages... you just can't see them. There have been a few first-few-days "issues" but they're getting fixed up asap. Tony posted a poll yesterday where he answered a lot of questions (you have to follow him to see it; it's the "Welcome 2.1 users" poll).

peckz3120 Home
06/30/13 1:59 pm

Susanr: I don't mean to be offensive but you're wrong. These are in fact embryonic cells, however, we no longer use those cells for research, for we can find embryonic cells in our bone marrow... Please when people argue these issues, know the current facts.

palindrome California
06/30/13 3:49 pm

You don't seem to know what we were saying. These are embryonic stem cells but they're only 4-5 days old, before they've taken on any living characteristics as the other guy put it

susanr Colorado
06/30/13 3:53 pm

peck - What do you mean, we no longer use those cells for research - do you mean embryonic stem cells? Some research programs are still functioning, with the "approved" existing stem cell lines, as far as I am aware, plus laboratories without...

susanr Colorado
06/30/13 3:55 pm

..any government funding are free to create their own lines, the last I knew anyway.

Are you saying there are *embryonic* stem cells in bone marrow? Or just stem cells?

rlands
06/29/13 7:17 pm

There are so many other stem-cells to use besides embryonic...

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Liberty 4,032,064
06/29/13 7:15 pm

No, because that money is first taken involuntarily from individuals.

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rolltribe Ohio
06/29/13 7:31 pm

By "involuntarily" do you mean when our democratically elected representatives vote to raise are taxes in a long thought out process that includes multiple branches of government that face checks and balances if they do something unconstitutional?

EarlyBird Portland
06/29/13 7:13 pm

RJ is back! He's kicking ass and taking names!

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:13 pm

I love all these selfish people who are willing to subject my generation to debt caused destitution in order to fund their little projects.

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EarlyBird Portland
06/29/13 7:14 pm

Do you really think stem cell research is a little project?

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:16 pm

It's not that it isn't important but we don't have money, private organizations can do it just fine. How about you guys have some responsibility and pay off your debt so that I don't have to do it for you

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:20 pm

Our debt isn't even a half percent of our total US assets.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:22 pm

So what do you want to cut scope?? Nothing, you're going to ignore the problem as it exponentially increases.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:24 pm

As of right now, it is not a problem.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:27 pm

Not now, but you're not going to address it your going to leave it until your generation is long in the ground. You will leave it for my generation to pay off. If we stop it now it won't be as painful.

violence Pretty hate machine
06/29/13 7:12 pm

Glad to see 'Yes' in the majority.

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DunkinFrunk Austin area, Texas
06/29/13 7:08 pm

I am in favor of all research that has the ability to improve life.

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Arkansas123 Neoconservative
06/29/13 7:10 pm

0_O

I guess scientists should start abducting homeless people for experimentation.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:11 pm

Yeah, let's just get crazy with that slippery slope fallacy! Good call!

After all, scientists do what they do to hurt people. That's their style.

DunkinFrunk Austin area, Texas
06/29/13 7:14 pm

Or you could actually learn what stem cell research is.

ThePhlegm The Lone Star State
06/29/13 7:49 pm

So bikerjim, you are for Joseph mengale's nazi "scientific" experiments?

And RJ, are you saying every scientist is just a perfectly good human? No bad apples in the bunch? Cause that is actually what you are saying...

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:04 pm

Not until we have a balanced budget.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:05 pm

We will never, ever have a balanced budget...that's for a reason.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:07 pm

Then we will never, ever have money for stem cell research, I guess private organizations will have to do it.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:08 pm

Do you understand how reality works? We don't have money? Are you serious? When has this country ever NOT spent for, well, anything?

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:08 pm

I swear, some of you live in a weird alternate universe, devoid of things called facts.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:10 pm

Ya we're actually doing pretty good. Balanced budget is not possible and we do have money to fund this. Problem solved.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:11 pm

You have an obligation to pay your debts, you're irresponsible. How dare your government spend trillions with the expectation that my generation will have to pay it off, to do that you would have to I don't know "live in a weird alternate universe"!

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:12 pm

You have no clue, whatsoever, how national economies work. We have been and will be #1...period. Get over your 3rd grade understanding of economics.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:15 pm

Fuck you, you think money grows on trees that you can spend money like its an unlimited resource, without consequence! You are going to destroy America for my generation, it is you who does not understand, inflation is coming!

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:17 pm

Please. Boo hoo. You live in the best time in the best conditions in the best country of all time. And you go out of your way to find reasons to be miserable over bllsht non-issues. Pathetic.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:24 pm

Well RJ: if it's so easy why the hell do we have a debt! Why don't you get a balanced budget so that it stops its rapid increase? Because your generation is selfish and lazy and refuses to sacrifice even a little.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:28 pm

My generation, wait, what?!?!

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:33 pm

@skinner, remember, to the true believers (RJ and others), their Prophet owns all the assets in America. So, $16 trillion is nothing as God Obama can sign an executive order to take what is needed.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:34 pm

Evocon: what on earth are you talking about?

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:37 pm

Wow. The retard is strong with this one.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:39 pm

RJ: your being terribly unclear and insults neither help your argument nor articulate your point.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:40 pm

RJ is a true believe in Progressive theories, a follower of a faith based system of political judgements. Progressives believe all assets in America are, really, public. They can be used by the government at anytime for any reason.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:43 pm

Evo: yeah I see what you mean. Scope is saying how we have 200 trillion in assets, well how much of that is owned by the government, not a lot. Stupid theory.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/29/13 7:43 pm

Therefore, RJ's people can create as much debt as they want. First, they believe the government multiplier will erase any current debt (note the European success with this). If that fails, they will simply liquidate assets to pay the debt.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:45 pm

I finally understand them now. The reason they don't care about the debt is because they don't believe in private property therefore money does grow on trees! It would never actually work though.

thatguy81 here
06/29/13 7:58 pm

Ok, seriously. The money is all fake anyways. It's not based on anything an printed whenever we want.

Who the fuck cares if we owe money to anyone? What happens when we say "not gonna pay you"? Nothing. Nothing would happen.

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 4:18 am

No live once we say that no one will ever lend us money again and confidence and investments in the American economy will plummet, essentially we would be lucky if we just had another recession.

thatguy81 here
06/30/13 6:38 am

^ ❤ this person

skinner Wisconsin
06/30/13 6:58 am

We aren't going to see that money anytime soon. the difference is our debt is increasing and our debtors are not.

Steve6453 Michigan
06/30/13 1:13 pm

RJ, wanna explain how this is "the best condition the best country has ever been in" I personally know several people who are barely scraping by in this terrible economy that would beg to differ.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 1:24 pm

Are times bad? Sure, but I don't feel it's fair to say things are terrible.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 3:12 pm

@erscopew, Krugman is a true believer in that theory. So have been the European countries having to salvage their countries' economies every 15 to 20 years. You would think a Nobel Laureate for Intn'l Econ would know better. Faith is Faith.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 5:24 pm

Please enlighten me with your ideas of fixing our current economic state. I'd like to hear something constructive instead of you trying to demoralize comments.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 5:58 pm

Thank you for the offer of 250 characters to resolve all economic ills, not enough space. My comments addressed Krugman's obsession with "printing" currency through a central bank. He scoffs at inflation because it does not occur within "hours".

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 6:05 pm

So you're mad about inflation?

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 6:17 pm

I am not mad (either emotionally or psychologically) about anything.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 6:21 pm

I didn't mean that to be derogatory, but curious if inflation was your main concern?

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 6:41 pm

The issue would be more than inflation. The current actions by this administration and Congress will cause more negative effects than inflation. I am presuming our current leaders will follow France's path over the last 40 years.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 6:46 pm

I can see where you are coming from. I think my main reason for being optimistic includes a lot of expectations for the next couple years. I think we have done a decent job in slowing down the recession through govt spending but I also know that ...

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/30/13 6:48 pm

Our next step is to slow this down and put it in the hands of the free market in the hopes it has gained enough momentum to continue growing. I don't disagree with you that we could end up like France, I'm just looking at it different.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 7:27 pm

I hope I am wrong. I had a dissertation built around the "hyper" inflationary effect of crude oil going above $30 a barrel (tells you how old I am). Hindsight had my formula with several weak assumptions. I hope I am wrong again.

evoecon nearest binary system
06/30/13 8:47 pm

Thank you for the reasonable discourse. Much appreciated.

TomM
06/29/13 7:03 pm

No we have no money and even if we had, I don't want it either.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:05 pm

We have more money than anybody. What planet are you on?

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:08 pm

Yes more money than anybody at $-7,000,000,000,000

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:09 pm

Yeah, because national economies are just like household finances.

FAUL

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:12 pm

7 trillion in debt compared to 200 trillion in assets as a country. 7 trillion is only a scary number because its too large to imagine. Put it next to 200 and yes, we're doing pretty good.

TomM
06/29/13 7:17 pm

Skinner: You have a typo missing a 1 in front of that
Erscopew: you read his typo
Current debts 17,000,000,000,000
usdebtclock.org

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:18 pm

Scope: that money has to come from somewhere and is anyone willing to cut or pay more, no! The consequences of the debt will only grow as it is ignored.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:22 pm

What's the inherent value of the United States of America.

18trillion isn't sht. Our economy, our country, and how WE RUN the world's financial system (yeah, read that again spanky) is not anywhere close to being a detriment.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:25 pm

Well RJ: if it's so easy why the hell do we have a debt! Why don't you get a balanced budget so that it stops its rapid increase? Because your generation is selfish and lazy and refuses to sacrifice even a little.

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:28 pm

@Tom sorry, I was going off his number. Even with that, our economy isn't as horrible as people say.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:32 pm

The debt is rising dramatically estimated to be 90% of our economic output by 2020
p.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/mar/26/cbos-2020-vision-debt-will-rise-to-90-of-gdp/?page=all

Mattiga14 Massachusetts
06/29/13 7:03 pm

Stem cells have the capability to save millions of lives.

Yes.

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Squidboy Snarkapottamus
06/29/13 7:03 pm

Are you in favor of Federal funding.....no.

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Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 7:09 pm

Ya because roads are stupid.

Arkansas123 Neoconservative
06/29/13 7:11 pm

Most roads are funded by the states.

Arkansas123 Neoconservative
06/29/13 7:02 pm

Not at all. It is unethical, and embryonic stem cells are rejected by the bodies of recipients. Doctors are better off using induced pluripotent stem cells harvested from the patient's own body or from the body of a family member.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:04 pm

How is it unethical? They are cells.

The ability to generate tissues from "pluripotent" somatic cells is extremely limited. It's not even close.

Arkansas123 Neoconservative
06/29/13 7:07 pm

We are even further away from being able to utilize embryonic stem cells.

It is unethical to harvest cells from someone, thus killing that individual, without his or her consent.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 6:58 pm

Wow. "No" vote gets a moron award winner.

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RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:07 pm

Yeah, circumvent a technology based on antiquated religious dogma...great call.

skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:08 pm

That's not necessarily why we voted no, I know it's not why I did.

magnum
06/29/13 6:57 pm

How are we not funding it already? We give billions to worthless crap every year.

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magnum
06/29/13 6:59 pm

To clarify, I mean lets take that money and use it for good by funding this.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
06/29/13 6:54 pm

If you can give oil companies subsidies, allow apple, GE, etc. to not pay taxes, and give politicians 175,000$ a year with benefits, then yeah, we can fund some science.

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skinner Wisconsin
06/29/13 7:06 pm

Or we could compromise and not fund any of them until we pay off our debt

Posco BBQ Enthusiast
06/29/13 6:54 pm

Yes. Yes. And another yes.

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DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
06/29/13 6:52 pm

There are plenty of other methods to obtain stem cells....

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Marley17 or is it just me...
06/29/13 6:55 pm

But none of them are as good or effective.

RJ1969 SoCal
06/29/13 7:00 pm

Really. Please. Let me know. I work in the field. Please, enlighten me.