My area received a generous 11&1/2 inches of snow last night setting a record for snowfall in March. Is it ok to stop using the term "global warming" yet?
I take the 1st Amendment seriously enough that you can call it what you will.
Well played, sir! ????????
Under that logic, cats = bears?
Both describe animals.
This was the reason for the question.
You guys are killing me.
We clearly can't be trusted with a public forum!
It'd be utter chaos in a matter of days.
Snow isn't an indicator of temperature as much as it is a indicator of increased precipitation. When we have more rain or snowfall, it is because warmer water temps and air temps (hold more water in warm air) are increasing.
That's what I was trying to say, far less eloquently I should add.
Not the debate.
I feel like a fireman, trying to put out fires.
I just want to unify the term, not debate it.
Ooooh. Well, you know how I get with science questions.
Ok I've got one.
Check the polls in about 2 minutes, the "propose question" box hates me.
How about the term from Futrama? "Global Wapa"
I will go with that until someone convinces me in a debate that Global Wapa is real.
Tilton- if you truly wanted this question to be about terminology and not about climate change (or whatever term you chose to use), then why was your first comment about a personal observation that it feels like the seasons have shifted by roughly a month?
I'm honestly not trying to be a jerk, but doesn't that statement lend itself to a debate/discussion about the effects (or lack thereof) of climate change rather than what to call it?
Simply stated, I don't like arguing within our group.
What we need to remember with "global warming" is that because its cold today doesn't mean the globe isn't warming. When the ice caps raise 1 degree, more melts. That fresh water is dumped into the salt water. More fresh water in salt equals easier precipitation. More precipitation means more snow.
???????? This is why I asked.
The fact is the climate is changing. How or why is almost irrelevant. We as a people need to do two things
1) Reduce our impact just as a safe rather than sorry. Either way, fossil fuels are tied to so many other problems.
2) Adapt to the fact that life will change. Complacency kills.
There is a reason society spurred at almost the same latitudes around the globe is something we need to remember. We weren't made to stay in Illinois 365 ????
Climate change or global warming?
That was the point of the question.
The earth is warming. There is no doubt about that. Everyone likes to forget in winter when they get record cold.
Remember the hottest 10 summers on record have been in the last 12 years
I actually am waiting for 1 of our centers in Texas to have an opening for VP GM.
It's hot as shit here man.
While you were getting record snow we were getting record heat.
90s in march.
The question isn't amount of snow, but the temperature. If the trend was record COLD then I may change from "global warming".
Maybe its usually 26 with 6" and now its 30 with 11"
Not trying to argue but the "not global warming" only comes out at winter when people get a crap ton of snow.
No one questions it when it's 105 degrees in May in Canada
Or when its 95 in San Antonio on march 6th.
It wasn't just the snow, it's record cold temperatures too.
What level of the atmosphere of cold? Ground level, might be evade of all the new damn snow...
I dunno man. The globe is getting hotter and weather is becoming more severe. What we call it is even less relevant than how.
We just need to stop arguing on a term and actually do something
Because of all*
**I am not a climatologist :p **
March has been 9 degrees colder than average. Also a record.
Maybe down South it's been hotter, but up here, it's been colder.
What does it mean?
Not a clue.
The question really was just about terminology, not the climate change debate.
I dunno what the means wait her besides move????
I think real debate starts after we get over what ever term we want to call it. We have spent 10 years arguing what to call it and have done almost ZERO to do anything about it.
It's not about microclimates, like 1 state. It's the average of daily temps for a year from all around the globe, they can be seen slightly increasing from year to year. An extra 2 weeks of 100°+ temps in TX, VT hitting 90° for 2 weeks, these add up. Army's right, the big storms are caused by ⬆temps
Not even Al calls it that anymore, having gotten on the "Climate Change" bandwagon years ago. No doubt the climate is changing though, or we'd still be shoveling snow and chipping ice in Panama. Or would be basking in the tropical jungle of northern Canada. With us or not, it's always been changing.
I believe that climate is changing and that we are contributing marginally to the change. The questions for me: 1) what is the true estimated impact of the change? 2) what can we truly do to change them? 3) what would it cost (not just $$, but as a society)? 4) are the costs worth the benefit?
The problem is that it's become so politicized by power-hungry politicians, money-grubbing companies, and grant-hungry scientists that people don't know who to trust or what is truth vs manipulation. It's a shame, and the scientific community is largely to blame.
People are too. Hybrid vehicle sales lagged early but took off after car makers stopped trying to make them look like "regular" cars. They figured out that a bigger motivation for people to buy hybrids is because they want to be *seen* driving hybrids.
Sometimes people just really suck.
I want to see the unbiased, "take it or leave it", no agenda driven numbers.
Hybrids are such ugly cars.
I'd buy one, the bodies need a redesign.
Clean lines, like a Camero, and I'd buy one.
Tony I agree with every one of your points. The one small doubt I have about our possible impact on climate has to do with contrails - both adding moisture and forming ice in an otherwise relatively stable layer of our atmosphere. We don't know enough about it to even make a guess yes or no.
You know they are melting the polls with microwaves from space to prove their point?
Ok that was a joke. However, I have seen some amazing sine wave shaped clouds that magically formed out of thin air on a sunny day. It rained cats and dogs ten minutes after clear sunshine. I will have to dig out that photo some time.
Although we do bombard the earth with microwaves for split transmitter receiver anti stealth radar.
Hey Zod, did you know that for the 3 days that there were no planes flying over the US after 09.11.01 that the average temperature increased by 1.6°C?
Funny thing, in VT people took cutting back on gasoline usage very seriously. To the point where the state is now raising our gas tax by 7¢ on the $ because they no longer have enough revenue to take care of the highways.
That is the real question, Tony. How much can we control, and what is the cost either way. We do know that the oil supply is dwindling, and there are a lot more important uses for it than transportation, so I have no idea problem with the hybrids or increased gas efficiency in general.
A farmer once reminded me that commercial fertilizers are made from petroleum distillates. Transport and food sustain our populations. I hope someone has a practical plan.
I don't have a problem with gas efficiency either. My current dream car is a Tesla, in fact. :-) I just have a problem with sanctimonious people who are more concerned with *looking* green (or spiritual, for that matter) than with actually being it.
Emma I didn't know that about the temperature increase, but in some areas contrails form an obvious cloud layer. It seems like they'd have an effect. Not science, just a question in my gut.
We have the same thing here with gas taxes; there's even talk of a $75 annual surcharge for hybrids and EVs.
Sorry, Zod. I didn't complete my thought. The lack of contrails caused the temp rise. because there wasn't that cloud layer. I just found it really interesting.
I mean, it didn't have any greater effect on global climate, just what was observed in the US for those days.
Zod putting a surcharge on hybrids and EVs is stupid idiotic and foolish in my opinion. We need to encourage it as much as possible. Demand for fuel will not decrease as we keep having kids etc. They can tax the fuel more or add to the vehicle registrations but don't do this now. ROI...
People pay more for these cars to get a return on their investment and make a difference. As volume increases the cost will decrease and the return on investment will be more tolerable. This sounds like a scheme to slow down the vehicle progress or stupidity for planing ahead.
That was my excited voice. Nothing aimed at anyone. Just passionate about making some progress.
They are ugly.
Very, very ugly.
They can't design them to look like a Dodge Avenger?
They cost so much more, for ALOT less options.
If you want people to buy them, redesign them.
Sounds like you can't understand why everyone doesn't.
If I'm sacrificing that much horsepower, it better be aesthetically appealing.
The word is changing. The ice is melting. Yes these are facts. Are we to blame? That's where it gets unclear.
The climate is changing, seasons are shifting, oceans are rising.
No politics, just personal observations.
When I was a kid, I remember seeing maps of 'tornado alley' & the southeast wasn't in it. Now it has been revised to include Alabama & W. Tennessee.
The problem is when politicians get involved
Has man caused some of it? Sure. Not all of it though. Can man do a better job of taking care of the earth? Absolutely.
It's not gonna happen because of the 'efforts' of an idiot like my state's own Albert Gore, jr. though...
That's pretty close to how I see it. Before I taught environmental science, I thought it was a load of garbage, probably bc Al Gore was so insistent on it. The more I learn though, the more I see that it is happening. The facts back it up.
Gore has proven consistently throughout his career that he is nothing more than a political opportunist and *capitalist* to the highest degree.
Thankfully; he seems to have lost relevance to folks all over the political spectrum. If anything; I think he has *hurt* a message that has some merit
Personally, I believe that the seasons have shifted by a month.
Colder than normal April, warmer than normal November.
I do not have any scientific data to back up my theory, just my opinion based on my observations. Which technically is the definition of the word "hypothesis".
It's so heavily dependent on where you live, though.
When I was a kid we always half-way joked that we got off for Spring Break because the last freeze of the year was always going to be in that week. No matter what.
Now we get our last freeze around the first week of February. That's if we get…
a freeze at all.
Likewise when I was a kid we always had to make sure our Halloween costumes had long sleeves. While it was rarely "cold" that evening, it was pretty much always chilly enough to warrant long sleeves. Now it seems like we don't even have to pull out our sweaters until
This past winter I wore my jacket once. And that was because I took the dogs out at around 3 am.
When people talk about visiting here or moving here I usually tell them that summer lasts from March to November (or I say "Easter to Thanksgiving") and that's not far off.
I'm disappointed. I only got a few inches of snow.
It's Spring though.
I don't want ANY snow.
Yeah, spring snow in Cincinnati always sucked too. Here it's just expected. I've been told we get some of our heaviest snowfalls in March. This is only my second winter here, and both years have been pretty light. Which isn't good because we haven't gotten much rain either, & we desperately need it.
I think it was OK years ago, when it became obvious that the issue was *climate change.* More extremes in general.
I think just saying climate change is better. I'm in the midst of that storm too
Climate change gives a better understanding for the general public. Warming doesn't happen the way that most people thing it does, and a lot of these mega winter storms are actually the result of it. Too much to type and deal with autocorrect to fully explain it though. Sorry.