Show of HandsShow of Hands

FemmeAdamWest October 21st, 2014 7:42pm

Inspired by cowboy: It's been said that doctors performing sex change operations are only fighting the symptoms of something instead of working to find the cure. Lets say there is no cure. Would you be okay with the operations then?

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Comments: Add Comment

kougrakub
10/23/14 10:24 am

I don't care what they do with themselves, as long as I don't have to pay for them.

JurassicCorndog Dance your cares away
10/22/14 7:35 pm

Nope, why live in the land of what ifs, that's not how it is. It is fun to think of these things, but be practical. But seriously, NO.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/23/14 9:59 am

I am practical. I took a premise that many people use as an excuse not to allow people to do what they want and expanded on it to see if their answers would change.

JurassicCorndog Dance your cares away
10/23/14 1:16 pm

You blatantly said "lets say there is no cure". It just isn't that way.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/23/14 1:17 pm

Many of SOH questions are based on "what ifs." Why do you have such a problem with mine?

JurassicCorndog Dance your cares away
10/24/14 1:52 pm

This is a pretty big topic, others are like, what if someone did this. But that being said, you are right, and I apologize for this.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 7:22 am

Moral of the story:

Some people spend ten years of their lives in the study of medicine and/or psychology. Therefore, they understand things. Other people are members of "Y'all Qaeda" and are ignorant enough to think they understand :)

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FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:24 am

I don't understand how people can be so dense that they say a professional is wrong just because they don't like the outcome.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/22/14 9:50 am

SM. Go off private for a few minutes.

MachoMatt84 Mountain climbing
10/21/14 10:29 pm

I'm ok with it if someone wants to do that to themselves. However, they should pay for it themselves. I also do not think it's the right course of action.

Rosebud Ohio
10/21/14 6:57 pm

Absolutely. And honestly, symptoms are all you can treat in that scenario. But unlike almost anything else, treating the symptoms can BE the cure.
Add to it, it's not harming me or anyone else in any way, so what good would preventing it do?

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TomLaney1 Jesus is Lord
10/21/14 4:59 pm

No. Because then it's expensive genital mutilation just to humor a delusional patient. That's irresponsible for a surgeon.

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JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 5:17 pm

Is getting your wisdom teeth removed mutilation?

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 5:27 pm

It is, by definition. But it is sometimes medically necessary, no? And that justifies it, no? Does the same not apply here? Is a mental ailment different from a physical ailment in this case?

TomLaney1 Jesus is Lord
10/21/14 11:50 pm

Yes. Better to treat the delusion than pretend it's not one, as most psychiatrists have done for several decades. Cure the delusion and the desire for mutilation disappears.

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/22/14 5:26 am

And how do you cure it?

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 7:20 am

You talk to the sky.

I'm not sure you're an authority on what's a delusion.

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 4:39 pm

Yes. I see it as a necessary medical procedure.

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 6:41 pm

This user is currently being ignored

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 6:52 pm

Not true at all. Is the life of someone getting their wisdom teeth taken out in danger? No. Is the procedure sometimes medically necessary? Yes.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/21/14 3:59 pm

Still think it is wrong. Sometimes we are given challenges in life that we have to just deal with.

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bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 4:01 pm

So dealing with challenges, in your opinion, means not taking action to improve your situation?

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 9:50 pm

Except when it's "wrong." Which is ... when? And why?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/21/14 10:34 pm

The change being discussed in this situation I don't believe improves the situation.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:25 am

You don't believe so, but it actually has for many people sooooo....?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/22/14 9:53 am

No, it just creates more problems and it avoids the fact that they have done issues they really need to face and deal with

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:55 am

Right now you're answering for a large group of people you have never known about something you've never experienced. Do you not see the problem here? Especially since there are many people out there who prove your statement wrong!

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/22/14 10:23 am

You want them to just avoid the real problems. And just because something hasn't happened to me doesn't mean I can't see the effects it can have on society.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/22/14 12:19 pm

What are their "real" problems then, Doctor Psychology?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/22/14 3:49 pm

Obviously we aren't going to agree on this, not really much point in continuing.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/22/14 3:57 pm

I'm fine with not discussing, as long as you aren't going to stand in the way of other people doing to their own bodies something that has absolutely zero effect on you.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/22/14 6:15 pm

I can't ever say it is ok for them to do. It may not directly effect me, but it can effect society. It is not good to just stand back and let others do wrong either.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/22/14 7:01 pm

So just to be clear, you're positing the propriety of taking action to interfere with someone's rights over their own body while simultaneously refusing to engage in a conversation about how this is justified?

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/22/14 9:29 pm

You said there wasn't much point in continuing the conversation because we won't ever agree, yet you continue to push the view that people should be prohibited from doing something purely because of these beliefs you aren't willing to discuss due to

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/22/14 9:29 pm

disagreement. I am pointing out that this is an untenable position.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/23/14 6:42 am

You think it's right I think it's wrong and I don't believe in the live and let live mentality. People need others even if they think they do not or say they don't want help and guidance

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/23/14 7:20 am

I agree that people often need help they don't want. My point is that you have failed to justify your insistence that SRS is one such instance.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/23/14 8:51 am

2 scenarios: a) They were born one way and something happened that made them feel the need to change it. B) God made them that way and it's apart of their life's challenge to deal with it as part of their personality,

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/23/14 8:59 am

Those are hardly the only two possibilities and I'm not sure what point you think that would make anyway.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
10/23/14 9:54 am

What do you mean what point? I wasn't trying to make a point. Just stating how I see it.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/23/14 11:49 am

... Sigh...

Yes, and to what end?

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 3:09 pm

I'm confused. What would the "cure" be? What do they think the problem is? Scientific evidence simply does not support the proposition that being born with certain genitalia aligns terribly well with assorted markers of identity that are culturally

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bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 3:10 pm

but not biologically linked to sex. So are they suggesting that the "problem" is merely that our culture links gender identity to arbitrary personal characteristics? I would certainly agree that this is *a* problem, but my understanding of gender

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 3:11 pm

dysphoria is that it is far more complicated than - and has actual neurologically unique components distinct from - simply being a very "masculine" female or a very "feminine" male.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 6:44 pm

The situation is confusing to me as well, I was just trying to build off their premise to see if I could get anywhere. Turns out I can't, I know, shocking!

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 6:56 pm

This is so obnoxious. They use one excuse and then when that doesn't work they just move onto the next. Might as well just say "I don't like them, they're icky" and be done with it.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/21/14 7:55 pm

At least that'd be honest :-P

swervin Maryland
10/21/14 2:51 pm

I'm fine with it, as long as private insurance or the person is paying for it. Tax payers shouldn't be paying for it.

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jvc1133 61535
10/21/14 2:48 pm

I have no problem with an individual doing what they want with their own body.

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AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:44 pm

What if you have to pay for it through your tax dollars?

jvc1133 61535
10/21/14 5:03 pm

My tax dollars go their own way, I don't worry. Be my guest.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 6:46 pm

We don't get to pick and choose *that much* with our tax dollars. And it wouldn't be good if we could. The things each of us find "worthy" differ.

Krystina Let Freedom Reign
10/21/14 2:43 pm

I'm totally okay with anyone doing whatever the hell they want to do as long as they are not non-consensually harming others. I don't understand why people get so hung up on what other people are doing.

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AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:43 pm

I'm only hung-up in it as it relates to the eventuality that I'll have to pay for it. See my comment thread down a little ways.

Krystina Let Freedom Reign
10/21/14 4:57 pm

Ugh Yukon, you had to go there? :) I'm VERY against a single payer system because of all the things you outlined below & more. That's when we really start to become a socialist country & our freedoms really get taken away. Liberals don't even

Krystina Let Freedom Reign
10/21/14 4:57 pm

understand what they're getting us into or what's in store for us if it goes that way.

Regardless, even though I have multiple transgender friends & I support their choices as individuals, I'll be damned if I want my tax dollars going to any type

Krystina Let Freedom Reign
10/21/14 4:57 pm

of surgery in this realm. It's not my job to pay for other people's choices. That's why this country was founded on the principles of individual freedom & individual responsibility.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 5:33 pm

Lol. You're funny. Of course I went there. :-)

SugarShaq
10/21/14 2:40 pm

As long as the patient is paying for it themselves and not running it through my BCBS (cancelled yesterday btw).

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Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 2:19 pm

Inspired by cowboy: everyone who didn't vote the same way I did is a communist.

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cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:16 pm

Of course not. It's inhuman to butcher the mentally disturbed and those "doctors" that do, should have their licenses pulled for violating the Hippocratic oath.

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DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 3:59 pm

Hmm.. I'm sure you are educated in the field to make such bold statements.
Tell me about your education.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 4:01 pm

I've done my research. It's called Body Dysmorphic Disorder.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 4:18 pm

Cowboy and education in the same sentence? .....

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!

*grasps for air*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 4:19 pm

More educated than most.

DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 4:27 pm

That's your answer cowboy? "More educated than most".

I see.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 4:29 pm

Well, I hope you saw it. If you were blind, this app would be useless.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:42 pm

He mentioned Body Dysmorphic Disorder. Any response to that because personal attacks are neither educational nor a proper debate technique.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 4:57 pm

Yukon, a proper severe technique? ... LOL cowboy and I have a long history so anything goes. If you want a proper debate technique, join a debate club, this is the fucking internet.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:08 pm

Can't debate scientific facts without looking like fool, so go for the cheap shot.... It's all you got.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 5:17 pm

Mentality disturbed is a fact, jackass? No, that's your opinion. Just because you say something doesn't make it a fact, but you seem to think so, and that's what makes you retarded.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:19 pm

You poor kid. You're so angry.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 5:32 pm

I can never get angry at broke back cowboys who makes me laugh with ridiculous comments even if I wanted too

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:36 pm

Such anger. Anger leads to hate.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 5:37 pm

I think paucity of thought and an inability to be civil are probably the case, abo. Tantrums are the dead give away.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 5:37 pm

LOL@ liking your own comments!!!

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 5:46 pm

Yukon, you never make sense to me. If you think my replies are tantrums, you're new to the internet.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/21/14 5:48 pm

Conservatives on SOH are the most sensitive conservatives in America. If you don't like what I say, ignore me. I prefer to be ignored by pansies anyway

Rosebud Ohio
10/21/14 7:01 pm

See Cowboy, that shows the limits of what you know right there. Not all people whoo are transgender have BMD.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:37 am

It's BDD Rosebud. Do some research.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 6:44 am

Which is it that you're talking about, Body Dismorphic Disorder or Bipolar Mood Disorder? Because BMD and BDD are two very different things...

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:46 am

Body Dysmorphic Disorder.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 6:47 am

Geez that one was on me, never mind... sorry, I haven't found my glasses yet this morning and mixed up our comments.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 6:50 am

(though that doesn't invalidate my comment, it just makes it unrelated)
Let's try this again. BDD is not the same as transgender. There are plenty of people with one and not the other.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:57 am

There's no such thing as "transgender". It's a made up term from a sick mind.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:00 am

Maybe you're the one who needs help, denying what's very easy to see and very real... Certainly delusions, possibly narcissism. Either way, help is available.
If it didn't exist, there wouldn't be so much on it and so many with it.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:05 am

Because of people like you, the mentally ill are able to pollute our society with their sickness. You're the one helping kill society by polluting children's minds.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:06 am

Definitely delusional.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:08 am

See what I mean? It's a sickness.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:10 am

Yes, and you should certainly seek help.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/22/14 7:11 am

He's not being delusional. BDD is a diagnosed and categorized DSM illness. Nothing delusional there.

Are you more upset that this is a real mental disorder or that cowboy knows about it?

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:13 am

Yukon I don't think you followed the conversation.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/22/14 7:14 am

So there's mental disorders catalogued in the DSM which is the official manual for mental disorders. People get diagnosed by trained doctors with having one or more of these disorders. For cowboy to say that's recognized mental disorder is

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:15 am

I don't need help. I know that there's two genders. You do not. You need an education on simple biology.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/22/14 7:16 am

is a mental disorder doesn't mean that there's something wrong with cowboy. It means there's something wrong with the person that's been diagnosed with the disorder by a trained doctor.

Acknowledging that the disorder exists is ok to do.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:18 am

Yukon in case you hadn't noticed, he's claiming education, not treatment, is how to cure illness. That there are two genders, man and woman. And that intersex doesn't exist.
Cowboy, here's an easy intro to intersex for you.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 7:25 am

There's a reason why medical school is complicated. Similarly, advanced degrees in psychology are complicated.

It's because the simpleton view of the world is ignorant.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:29 am

Rosebud. There's a reason why education, in America, is failing our children. There's men, and women. What don't you understand?

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:36 am

Just check out the link Cowboy. I picked Wikipedia, because it uses pretty simple language.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:38 am

There's men, and there's women. What don't you understand?

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/22/14 7:52 am

She doesn't understand why you keep saying that when there is medical consensus that diverse intersex bodies are normal forms of human biology.While she doesn't expect you to understand that, I still give her credit for trying to educate your dumbass

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:55 am

She claims that she went to college and still doesn't get simple biology, and neither do you.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/22/14 7:59 am

I never said I did, genius. I'm telling what the medical consensus says. Are you a part of the medical community?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 8:05 am

No. Yet I know that there's men, and there's women. Amazing, huh?

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 8:24 am

It doesn't take much talent or intellect to be an ignorant truck driver.

It's a dead-end job that doesn't require critical thinking skills. This is exemplified in a complete lack of understanding of everything except the most basic concepts.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 8:26 am

"I have a Ph.D. in psychology."

"I deliver meat."


^ spot the difference.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 8:27 am

Interestingly enough, if he was sick and dying, THEN he might start believing doctors know what they're doing.

Otherwise? He's an ignorant asshole.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 8:30 am

I understand that you have a mental disorder. It's why you stalk women online. Get help before you hurt someone, if you haven't already.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 8:33 am

Yeah that's why I'm winning at life and you're a loser.

What does that say about you, dear cowboy? LOL

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 8:34 am

If you can't even do anywhere nearly as well as someone you have such a low opinion of, you must REALLY be a failure.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 8:34 am

Why do you hate yourself so much?

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/22/14 8:34 am

Let's end this thread please. Everybody have a good day.

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 9:16 am

Agreed, Yukon :)

The city's gorgeous today!

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:21 am

And the mentally disturbed gets to walk our streets...

Sandshrew Centennial
10/21/14 1:53 pm

What ever makes you happy, as long as it dose not hurt me

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cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:17 pm

It hurts our society. Think of the children.

Rosebud Ohio
10/21/14 7:01 pm

And the children who are transgender?

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 7:54 pm

There's no such thing.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 7:55 pm

There's only the mental disorder.

Rosebud Ohio
10/21/14 8:05 pm

Assuming it was a mental disorder, children can have them as well. It's not like diseases hold off until someone turns 18.

Sandshrew Centennial
10/21/14 9:38 pm

When they are of age and pay for it out of pocket I don't care

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:31 am

Proper education would help those children.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 6:54 am

So when kids have an illness we should be teaching them about the illness, rather than treating the illness?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:01 am

There's two genders kids. Man. Woman. Any questions?

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:04 am

1) Woman isn't a gender, it's female.
2) Not true, most obviously you're missing intersex.
3) Should we take that approach for the flu, measles, and depression too? "You don't need treatment, here's a textbook! That'll make it all better!"

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:05 am

Man isn't a gender either, btw. It's male and female.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:07 am

Obviously you need a biology lesson.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:09 am

Proper education would help you, and our children.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:10 am

I would love one, but from someone qualified to teach it and who understands that man and woman aren't genders, and that "education" isn't how you treat disease.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:13 am

There's men and there's women. What are you having trouble with?

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 7:15 am

I'm not having trouble with any of it. I actually paid attention in biology. Then again, that was college level. Did you not get that far?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 7:16 am

Then why are you having trouble understanding simple biology?

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/22/14 11:25 am

"I understand biology" - Dr. Cowboy

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/22/14 12:03 pm

Then why does the medical community disagree with you?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 12:10 pm

I agree with Dr. Paul Mchugh.

Rosebud Ohio
10/22/14 4:01 pm

You agree with this guy, who picks and chooses bits of studies to try and stick with the same psychiatric views held 50+ years ago?
tinyurl.com/nbav9mg

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 1:49 pm

I really don't care much about it as long as I and my tax dollars don't have to pay for it. I can't comprehend why anybody would want to do this or why any doctor would recommend it, but I don't care.

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AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 1:51 pm

Unfortunately, the eventual adoption of a single payer system will mean that every voter's opinion on this issue becomes relevant. Another draw-back to single payer.

DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 4:01 pm

I'm sorry. I don't understand your second comment. Would you mind explaining it to me?

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:27 pm

I think it's inevitable that we will adopt a single-payer healthcare system in the US. I believe that's what Obamacare is designed to segue into. Once everybody's personal healthcare is paid for by the taxpayer then everybody's health becomes

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:28 pm

Becomes a voter concern and subject to public policy. Every voter has a say in public policy and so every voter will have a say in policies that affect people's health, including whether NYC style bans on big sodas is a good idea.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:29 pm

Of course, whether or not to cover transgender surgery will also be subject to the collective will of the people and no longer just a matter of personal choice.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:31 pm

Yup. The battle against sodas, sugar, and everything else deemed "bad" for people that eventually has a healthcare cost associated with it will become a target for voters and bureaucrats looking to make precious few healthcare dollars go a

DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 4:32 pm

Ahh.. That explains a lot right there.
Ty.

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:32 pm

Long way. Personally, I will agitate with my elected representatives to oppose all coverage of surgeries such as these and my vote will be used as a weapon against politicians that cater to the special interest lobby that's representing the

AbandonedAccnt Not here.
10/21/14 4:33 pm

The transgendered interests.

Let them have the surgery, but if they want my tax dollars to pay for it then they'll have to accept the idea that my opinion and biases really do matter to them. Right now it's none of my business. That will change.

fredd TrumpLand
10/22/14 5:03 pm

I don't see single-payer as inevitable at all. Even in the UK, which has possibly the largest single health organization in the world, has a private sector to cater for medical treatments not available on the NHS.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
10/21/14 1:24 pm

Lots of incorrect things get said, but that doesn't make them any more true.

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TopsQueen Oregon Coast
10/21/14 1:15 pm

Absolutely. There is nothing wrong with needing a sex change operation. Sometimes chromosomes get scrambled. People that require a sex change start showing opposite gender preference around four or so. And identifying with the other gender.

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cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:17 pm

No one "needs" a sex change.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 1:03 pm

I am in favor of the operations now. I see them as essential for some.

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TopsQueen Oregon Coast
10/21/14 1:15 pm

True as can be.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:19 pm

They're not essential. It's promoting a mental disorder.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:23 pm

I just don't agree with you on this, Cowboy. I believe that anyone who would take the steps to go through the operation and the or pre and post-op treatment are at a point in their lives that it is necessary to their well being. They also need to

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:23 pm

continue mental health treatment too. I just don't think that you and I will ever agree on this issue.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:25 pm

You disagree with scientific facts. That's illogical. How is altered, mentally deranged individuals, good for our society?

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:30 pm

And that is where we differ. Science does not say they are mentally "deranged" nor does it say that they are harming society in any way. Most are good hearted people who are contributing members of society like you and I. I think you sometimes fear

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:32 pm

those that are different from you and that fears manifests itself into hatred and unacceptance. You and I may never really understand the mental anguish these people go through, but we can still love them as we would any other human who has not done

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:34 pm

us any wrong. Cowboy, I would never ask you to say you are OK with the procedure if you aren't. I would just ask that you open your heart to accepting them as people, people who want to be loved like anyone else and live their lives happily.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:36 pm

It's called Body Dysmorphic Disorder. It's well known. I'm trying to help them, and our society. Our children should not be subjected to horribly disfigured people, by butchers.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:38 pm

It's sad that someone would hate themselves so much, but let's not let them hurt themselves. It's our duty as a sane society.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:39 pm

I know what it is called. But "deranged" is no where in the diagnosis. Just let them be themselves and be happy. A child who talks or interacts with a transgendered person will not be harmed in anyway.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:40 pm

Now THAT is an opinion. Of course children would be damaged by this insanity.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 2:42 pm

OK... well I have had my say and I know I won't convince you otherwise. I will try again another day. :)

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:46 pm

Not on this. Butchering the mentally ill is criminal.

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 4:43 pm

Kay, you're honestly amazing.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 4:45 pm

Why? Because she thinks that letting children interact will the mentally ill is good for our society?

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 4:51 pm

Cowboy, could you please specifically state how interacting with a trans person is harmful to the well-being of a child?

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 4:52 pm

They are mentally ill.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/21/14 5:07 pm

Thanks, Jenna! That is very sweet to say! <3

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:11 pm

That's it. Hug it out while society crumbles around our children.

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/21/14 5:15 pm

Cowboy, could you be more specific in how this is damaging to children?

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:17 pm

They are mentally ill.

cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 5:20 pm

What more do you need?

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 6:50 pm

Having a mental illness doesn't immediately make you a threat to children, I have 3. If you can't expand on your point to a specific I will assume you don't have any and are just pulling things out of your ass.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:40 am

"Having a mental illness doesn't immediately make you a threat to children". Yes, yes it does. What mental illness do you have.

JennaF sunflower state of mind
10/22/14 6:45 am

Does having depression make you a threat to children?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 6:51 am

Everyone gets depression. Without proper treatment children have been murdered because of it. Someone with BDD hates themselves so much that they think cutting off body parts will "fix" them. That's simply not true.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:19 am

You still haven't expanded on how exactly it's bad for children.
Also, I'm not sure why it matters what 3 I have since you made an unspecified blanket statement that if you have a mental illness you're bad for children.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:21 am

I believe a transgendered person with love in their heart and love to give would be a much better parent than someone who is filled with this much hate for anything that isn't just like them.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:27 am

What hate? Those people hate themselves and aren't mentally stable. If some mentally unstable person thought they were a dog, and taught children that it's "normal", would that hurt or help a child?

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:29 am

While inward hate is bad, the hate YOU and people like you spread outwardly is much much worse.

Also, that whole dog comment is uncomparable, so aside from me mentioning that, I'm going to ignore it.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:33 am

Of course you are. Ignoring the problem won't make it go away.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:34 am

And no amount of surgery, from a butcher, will either. It's all in your head.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:41 am

Is that a heroin needle tattoo on your arm? The kids must be proud...

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:44 am

Lol a heroin needle? I'm pretty sure all needles look the same, so that would just be what? A needle tattood with the word heroin in the middle?

It looks absolutely nothing like a needle, and yes my son absolutely loves it.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:46 am

That's just great... Must be so proud...

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:48 am

Yup, also proud of the other two, thanks for noticing.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:49 am

The family that does heroin together, stays together...

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:50 am

Aww yes because I have tattoos I must do heroin, of course.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:52 am

It's a heroin needle..

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 9:53 am

Are you really this dense or do you just play so online?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 9:55 am

I can see why your mind is clouded. You shoot up. It's good for the kids...

Kay41 the Midwest
10/22/14 1:11 pm

Cowboy, you are being a jerk. It is obvious that her tattoo isn't a heroin needle. How would you like it if someone made that kind of false accusation against you and because of it you NEVER got custody of your daughter. Shame on you for doing that.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/22/14 1:13 pm

You can come back with any rationalization or inane comment, but when it comes down to it you said things that you should never have said. Shame!

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:13 pm

What is it then?

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:14 pm

Looks like a needle to me.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:16 pm

Yeah... I'm the jerk. While all of you are for butchering the mentally ill.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/22/14 1:17 pm

You are ridiculous. Even if it did look like a needle, which is doesn't (or are you really that stupid?) you don't have the right to accuse someone of heroin use with absolutely nothing to go on. Absolutely shameful, unChristian and ridiculous.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:20 pm

A giant needle on the arm is good indication.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/22/14 1:22 pm

Case closed... you really are that stupid.
It's really too bad because I use to at least respect that you had strong opinions and stood up for them. But, I don't respect anything about you any longer with the way that you treat others.

Kay41 the Midwest
10/22/14 1:23 pm

You are now officially the first person I am putting on ignore.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:24 pm

I see. You respect my strong opinion until I disagree with one of your hot button issues... Laughable.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:26 pm

I'm real hurt... I don't want anyone that wants to butcher the mentally ill reading my comments anyway. I prefer sane people that want to help the children of our future.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/22/14 1:27 pm

It's a sonic screwdriver, but unless you're into sci-fi you're not going to know that.

And I've seen Kay disagree with you before so that bit about her only respecting you until she disagrees is complete bullshit.

cowboy Here and There
10/22/14 1:29 pm

Fine. Fair enough. I don't know what that is. Sorry.

WildRice With a side of sass
10/21/14 12:53 pm

I'm not gonna lie after reading that this poll was inspired by cowboy I was afraid to read on...

Reply
droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:54 pm

As Abolitionist once said, "anything inspired by cowboy is usually fucking stupid".

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 12:56 pm

There's a lot. I dare you to type cowboy in the search engine. There is a lot related to football, but a lot more saying "inspired by cowboy" usually from those of us he has driven crazy.

TopsQueen Oregon Coast
10/21/14 1:16 pm

Not a female Adam West writes it

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 9:26 pm

seriously, drooski, if there were awards for most commented user polls...

droo Santa Barbara
10/22/14 11:10 am

Nemacyst is a cop? Holy shit that's scary.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/23/14 10:06 am

Scary indeed. But his attitude makes sense now.

DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 12:48 pm

If it stops them from suicide attempts of course I am.

Reply
Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:53 pm

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DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 12:56 pm

Those kinds of treatments haven't worked. Unless you think keeping them so doped up they can't function is good treatment.

DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 12:57 pm

Why the fuc k does it bother you what someone does with their own body?

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:01 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:02 pm

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DoCiDuLi
10/21/14 1:19 pm

Don't lower your mentality to cowboys.
If altering the body is the best way of treating these people, at this time, they shouldn't be shamed.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:23 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:47 pm

Nope. A better cure is using transphobic slurs against them, as Jesus would!

Reply
aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 1:06 pm

That seems to be the consensus here unfortunately. I just can't even.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:16 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 1:25 pm

profound, Nem. you're better than this.

droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 1:27 pm

Ehh, I don't think he is, really.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:29 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 1:32 pm

Was it ever funny?

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:36 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 1:37 pm

If anyone likes fucked up and dark humor, it's me. But the fucked up and dark humor has to be humorous, not just fucked up and dark.

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 1:38 pm

I can't stand Dane Cook.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:38 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 1:39 pm

@drooski- yeah, agree. I can't really think he's funny after he said I was responsible for being raped and a coward for not reporting the second one. This trolling really isn't funny. How about we earnestly discuss some of these issues instead?

droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 1:40 pm

I never said others didn't find it funny. Obviously I meant *I* didn't find it funny. if cowboy's sense of humor were the standard for comedy, we'd be fucked.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:53 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:54 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 1:58 pm

Transfolk are comparable to kleptomaniacs and rape victims are cowards for not reporting? Well, damn, when did you become the expert on 15th century pyschology?

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:00 pm

maybe these are the humors that I was hearing about.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:02 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:03 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:05 pm

humor was a reference to medieval medicine.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:06 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:07 pm

the four humors?

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:08 pm

Wow, you're awful. The police mistreated me the first time. I don't think you get what rape does to a person. I wasn't enduring that pain again. And I'm glad I didn't inform you more about my friends case you offered to "help" with.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:08 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:09 pm

why do you keep saying "the people have spoken"? The demographics for your polls are almost exclusively white, Christian, Republican, males- that's hardly "the people".

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:09 pm

Interesting you don't think it's an abusive cops fault. I also think it's scary that you lack so much understanding of reactions to rape while dealing with it directly as a cop. This my friends, is why people like me keep our mouths shut.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:09 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:10 pm

Is high school curriculum the extent to which your knowledge encompasses?

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:10 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:11 pm

Fuck you, I'm not exposing a woman who already tried to kill herself twice to you. You're scum and the reason people hate police. I really don't know how you live with yourself.

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:11 pm

You really don't get it.

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:12 pm

there's nothing about comedy.

and blaming someone for what someone else does to them... I'm not sure how you justify that one.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:12 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:13 pm

Nemacyst, like political, is another ScottyDoesNo/cowboy parrot. Don't blame him; he just needs a group to fit in.

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:13 pm

Ignored again. I'm still dealing with PTSD and can't handle this shit. I hope you feel good about yourself and all the tape victims you've probably hurt. My friend doesn't deserve to be stabbed again, I'm not exposing her to a toxic cop like you.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:13 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:15 pm

Oh I know nemacyst, you'd be 100% rational and capable of fighting a cop right after being raped, go on, I'm sure you'd be quite the hero.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:15 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:15 pm

No one except the guy who did it. or are we excusing that, now?

droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:15 pm

lol are you implying I take only liberal arts classes er sumthin? I'm a Biochem major. Regardless, I don't need liberal arts classes not to be an uneducated dumbass. The irony is Criminal Justice is technically liberal arts...

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:16 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:17 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 2:17 pm

@drooski- I get that a lot too. As a computer science major lol

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:18 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:19 pm

and I as a physicist.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:19 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:20 pm

@AJ lol apparently understanding history, pyschology, human decency, and common sense makes you a Liberal Arts major.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:21 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 2:21 pm

you said she has no one to blame but herself. I'm saying the guy who raped her is someone who just may be to blame. call me old-fashioned, but I don't think he's excused.

droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:23 pm

Google "Criminal Justice" degree, and you'll find virtually every university organizes the major into their College of Liberal Arts.

Look, I'm not down-playing your degree- just pointing out the irony of you hating on liberal arts when your major

droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 2:24 pm

is, in fact, a liberal arts degree.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 2:32 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 4:44 pm

@drooski- I hear that a ton! And agree. No one needs a degree in some kind of liberal arts program to understand human decency.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 4:56 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:03 pm

Nem, in a good system, he gets locked up and we start to move forward. if the cop was abusive, or even just unhelpful, then we cannot, right? but we know that, even if not in the majority of cases, an unacceptably large number of rapists, especially

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:06 pm

those with whom the victim is familiar, go free. we then push blame onto the victims, as we feel a need to blame someone in addition to the perpetrator, and can't seem to see the cracks in the system.

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:10 pm

we accept that the perpetrator is to blame, but feel (and correctly, at that) that it's not the whole story. but with whom does that blame lie: the cop who wouldn't help, or the victim who doesn't want to keep re-living the experience?

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 5:10 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 5:11 pm

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aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 5:14 pm

@firefly- thank you. Seriously. It was probably the worst thing I've ever lived through, and I don't think I have the strength to do it again. People underestimate how extensively rape can damage you. It's really not worth reliving for a minimal

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:16 pm

a stolen tv? sure. I mean, I've experienced this, and while it's annoying, it's not exactly personal. I've never been raped. I've never (knowingly) been close to someone who's been raped. it seems like the sort of thing that may be more personal than

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 5:17 pm

Chance of the rapists being put in jail. Plus, one is out of the country for good anyway. The girl nema offered to help with is one who had extensive physical damage and was mistreated like me. She also doesn't think she could live this again. I

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/21/14 5:18 pm

Think nema fails to understand the limits of a trauma victim, male female or otherwise. A person can only handle this so much. Then they break. You don't think you'll break until it's you; I know I didn't.

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:19 pm

having my tv stolen, though. I'll speculate that just maybe, there are a lot of things running through your head that don't all make sense. from the outside, things always look different. I don't know, though, so I'd have to defer to someone who

firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:20 pm

has been through this. if that's you, then I whole-heartedly apologize for any assumptions I've made. but if it's not, I suspect that apology should come from you.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 5:27 pm

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Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 5:28 pm

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firefly5 the verse
10/21/14 5:32 pm

if you don't have time to hear all this, couldn't you just, you know, not read it?

StilettoMiss SF med law, meme queen
10/22/14 7:28 am

I'm coining a new term to describe this ignorant right-wing mentality.

They're members of "Y'all Qaeda".

Similarly, they too are interested in denying common humanity for their weirdo agenda.

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/22/14 10:10 am

@stilletto- I like it :) it's unfortunate how callous some will be just to seem "edgy" or whatever the hell. Like, it's not edgy, trans people and rape victims have gotten shit for hundreds of years. Or he's a sadistic asshole who truly thinks these

aj1545 Cat Lady
10/22/14 10:11 am

Things, concerning that he thinks rape is justified in some cases and is a cop.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/22/14 10:24 am

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firefly5 the verse
10/22/14 10:36 am

what is it, exactly, that you're trying to accomplish? What's your end game here?

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 12:43 pm

I know that the premise of the question requires you to believe being transgendered is a disease, which many of us don't, but I'm sure you see my angle here, and I'm sorry for any of my friends I may have offended by asking this.

Reply
Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:45 pm

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FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 12:48 pm

I didn't leave it out for lack of understanding but for lack of space.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:52 pm

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cowboy Here and There
10/21/14 2:20 pm

Why would anyone be offended by a scientific fact? That's silly.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:43 pm

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Reply
Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:44 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:46 pm

Your use of transphobic slurs makes you appear transphobic, not your hate of a transperson.

The same as a white man using racial slurs against a black man- it's not racist for him to hate a black man; it's racist for him to use racial slurs.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 12:47 pm

I didn't see that, I just know I've seen cowboy state it more than once, and just too me in a conversation minutes ago.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:47 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:49 pm

I didn't say transphobic slurs were the same as racist slurs. I said transphobic slurs imply transphobia the same way racial slurs imply racism.

I know reading comprehension is hard sometimes

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:51 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:53 pm

Words of mine, yes. Taken out of context, yes.

It's okay, man, we can work through this. One syllable at a time, if that's what it takes.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 12:56 pm

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droo Santa Barbara
10/21/14 12:57 pm

Whatever helps you sleep at night, buddy.

FemmeAdamWest in the Tardis library
10/21/14 12:58 pm

That's not what droo said or meant. I don't know why you're twisting his words just to cause an argument. There's arguments to be had all over this place without taking things out of context to do it.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
10/21/14 1:02 pm

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