Show of HandsShow of Hands

BeachSt October 15th, 2013 8:55pm

The Supreme Court heard arguments today over a case concerning Affirmative Action. Justice Scalia said it doesn't apply to "only THE blacks." Whether you agree with him or statement or not, might Justice Scalia be racist?

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curly
10/16/13 9:11 pm

Just because the judge used the word "the?" That's more than a stretch. Definitely need more than that.

ishady 86451132020
10/15/13 5:34 pm

Scalia is an idiot. This is no surprise.

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Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/15/13 4:46 pm

Scalia can't be a racist because, to him, racism has been over since the 60s

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/17/13 8:36 am

So what? There's a possibility that one of the most powerful men in the government is racist. I'm surprised to hear this.

Arkansas123 Neoconservative
10/15/13 3:41 pm

Can I see what he said in context?

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palindrome California
10/15/13 3:25 pm

I don't think it's racist in and of itself. But it's most often the case. Usually people who say that tend to view the group being mentioned with disdain and as being less or inferior. THE blacks. THE Jews. THE Arabs.... Call them by their damn name

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palindrome California
10/15/13 3:26 pm

Blacks. Arabs. Jews etc... Why say THE in front of the word as if they're objects?

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 3:34 pm

You're back! Woohoo

SOH is in desperate need of some sanity

zman117 Ohio
10/15/13 5:13 pm

Good to see you palindrome! You have been missed. Hope all is well

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:23 am

Remember the conservative Supreme Court justice that in a trial discussing standards of decency and indecency I believe it was, said "I know it when I see it." Perhaps it's like that with racism. I
Agree with you about racism many others don't

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:27 am

and they won't see it. Either because like justice whats his face they insist it don't exist, they refuse to see it, they see is political correct nonsense, or they don't know it when they do see it. Rendering all points about race moot to them.

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:30 am

Nevertheless, Pal, for those of us who know it when we see it you are spot on. On the other hand for those who don't know it when they see it and consider themselves not racists - they may as well be racist for all the good their opinions views are.

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:32 am

Moreover, whether intended or not they give aid, comfort, and cover to obvious racists like justice what's his face. I can't spell his name lol. Anyway one man's opinion.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:08 pm

He is somewhat racist IMO, but I don't see that this quote has much to do with it. It looks like clumsy wording. His racism is in his OPINIONS, not his throwaway observations.

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PeppyHare Do a barrel roll
10/15/13 2:32 pm

Saying someone is black isn't racist, I'm white. I don't think there's anything wrong with the context of what he said either.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:10 pm

Another one that doesn't get it. I capitalized it. Look below.

DavesNotHere where am I
10/15/13 2:31 pm

I'm no fan of Scalia, but this wasn't racist to me. I'd like to hear an audio clip of the remark.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:11 pm

Do you need one. THE blacks is not something that should ever be said by a Supreme Court justice. It's implies inferiority. It was a poor Choice of words that shows us his inner racist.

DavesNotHere where am I
10/15/13 3:51 pm

Yes, I do need one. I'd like to know the context of his reply. I don't know what the other people said. One line by itself courtesy of the Puffington Host doesn't do it for me. Clarence Thomas probably agreed with him.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 4:14 pm

He probably did. He probably didn't say THE blacks, though.

DavesNotHere where am I
10/15/13 6:45 pm

Your beef is him using 'the' before blacks. I'd still like to know of the context. I don't know how old Scalia is, but he might have meant it in a harmless manner. Just the same as older generations said colored before black was used.

skinner Jersey City
10/15/13 2:12 pm

"Only THE whites." Am I racist now? I'm not sure if I understand this question.

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political Georgia
10/15/13 2:25 pm

Skinner, if I said the black vote majority went to Obama, I would be considered a racist. This is just insane.

Abolitionist Voice of the people
10/15/13 4:54 pm

Why would you be considered racist for that political? Or rather, who would say you're a racists for saying that?

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:19 am

Interestingly I read a poll tonight saying the president receiving the record percentage of black votes, not Obama, and still holds the record is LBJ. Imagine that - your statement below reminded me of that.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:08 pm

How is this racist?... Because he forgot to say African Americans? Give him a break! You get his point.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:13 pm

NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! I freaking capitalized it, and y'all all still missed it. You don't say "THE blacks." "Those blacks." "Those coloreds." "Those niggers." The in front of black and boy are old, racist terms. It's sad he still uses them.

skinner Jersey City
10/15/13 2:14 pm

So Beach if I say "the black community needs assistance" I'm racist?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:16 pm

No! Maybe if you grew up in a black community, then you would understand how it's an offensive statement.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:16 pm

Oh! So "the" is now a racist word. Please!!!

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:18 pm

You're kidding me...

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:18 pm

Its implications are racist in that context. I don't how you're not getting this

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:18 pm

I need you to grow up, grow some brain cells, and go say that in a predominantly black neighborhood while everyone's outside.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:19 pm

You know we are a nation filled with too much political correctness, if I can't say "the blacks" without being condemn racist. That is taking it too far.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:21 pm

"I need you to grow up, grow some brain cells, and go say that in a predominantly black neighborhood while everyone's outside."

Okay! I will make sure I will not say, "I went to THE black neighborhood to see a couple of my friends."

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:21 pm

If NOT being politically correct is racist, then you better be politically correct when it comes to this. I dare you to say something like "food stamps is only for the blacks." You just don't say "the blacks." Did you not learn this......

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:21 pm

What happened to my comment?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:21 pm

Okay, I'm done. It takes a little complex thinking to figure out. Well, actually it doesn't, but it might for some.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:22 pm

Or it might just take experience growing up in a black community. Or having black in you. One of those might open your eyes.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:22 pm

Beach, I would not say that last comment because it is factually incorrect. I would say there are more of "the" white people on food stamps.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:24 pm

I will visit my friends in the black neighborhood tomorrow. Oh! I guess I am now racist. I am fed up with people trying to condemn people a racist for no good reason.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:26 pm

The black vote went to Obama. Am I now a racist? The Hispanic vote went to Obama? Am I now a racist? The White vote went to Romney. Are any of these statements racist?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:27 pm

There is a reason. It's an antiquated statement used to condemn blacks in the old days. THOSE colored folks. THOSE niggers. It's really never been used in a good light. You have to study stuff and live it to know.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:30 pm

Don't confuse the "N" word with what he said. He called blacks simply the "the blacks". Answer my question about "the" black vote. Is that racist?

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:38 pm

"The black vote went to Obama while the white vote went to Romney" doesn't have the same derogatory implication as "the blacks....." IMO

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:44 pm

Why not? Same words... Instead of talking about the issue, we are bogged down with political correctness.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:45 pm

It's not the words, it's what you're implying

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:46 pm

That blacks are black.... Sure that is their race. Scalia was trying to make a broader point.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:52 pm

Wow, I didn't realize I'm literally going to have to spell EVERYTHING out for you.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:56 pm

Oh! So no explanation? Instead you wish to insult my intelligence.... Stay classy my friend!

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:57 pm

Why would I bother is the better question

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:58 pm

Maybe because you don't have a quality explanation. Go figure! I pointed out the hypocrisy to have others cuss at me.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 3:00 pm

My best weapon is your ignorant argument, study some race relation history and you'll realize the implication behind saying "THE blacks"

political Georgia
10/15/13 3:00 pm

....excuse me! Having my intelligence insulted....

political Georgia
10/15/13 3:02 pm

So "the black vote" is not racist? Same context.... Except Scalia said Affirmative Actions does not only apply to the blacks.

political Georgia
10/15/13 3:03 pm

If you read into what he is saying, his statement is anything but racist. It means he is advocating for equality.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 3:08 pm

"The" has been used in that context by racists forever, the only purpose for including the word "the" (which isn't needed for the sentence to make sense grammatically) is to imply that African Americans are inferior, or different, not part of us

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 3:09 pm

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about if this is news to you.


He could have just as easily said "only blacks" or "only African Americans"

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:09 pm

@rolltribe, right? It has to be spelt out letter by letter. T-H-E. The black vote is not the same as "this isn't only for THE blacks." That implies that BLACKS are the undesirables (I can't think of the word). The people below you. THOSE people.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:13 pm

I think Beach's point is that the phrasing is a way of subtly othering/fetishizing black people, as though you're a scientist studying an animal or something. It's subtle, and personally I think someone otherwise non-racist could slip up, but I get

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:14 pm

the point. That said, regardless of phrasing, the best evidence of Scalia's racism IMO is his awful opinions and their disproportionate negative impact on minority communities.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 3:19 pm

@bethany about the possibly of a slip up.

Based on Scalia's history that would be a pretty big coincidence, I'm not buying it

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:23 pm

Finally someone else gets it, though. I don't find it quite subtle, but I'm thankful someone understands.

palindrome California
10/15/13 3:28 pm

They're idiots. Just forget about it. If Obama had made a remark and said THE Jews, these assholes would be all over him

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:34 pm

Sorry, Beach -- I meant "subtle" from a privileged perspective. It's not something white people learn to notice. And rolltribe, fair enough. I can see how someone saying something like this might be simply tone-deaf, but Scalia's no random "someone."

political Georgia
10/15/13 3:59 pm

Isn't it ironic Scalia is being framed as a racist, when his statement is expanding equality......

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:11 pm

How does his statement expand equality, exactly?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 4:13 pm

@political, would "racially insensitive" be better for you?

political Georgia
10/15/13 4:17 pm

He was saying the 14th amendment applies to everyone....

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:19 pm

Again, how does that "expand" equality? Seems to me it's just a statement of what the law already is, no?

political Georgia
10/15/13 4:24 pm

Excellent point, Bethany! The problem is that certain groups are protected by Affirmative Actions, while others aren't. Colleges can use race as a factor. Businesses must have a certain amount of minorities. If I am not mistaken, Scalia was.....

political Georgia
10/15/13 4:25 pm

....attempting to explain that special privileges should not be given to a certain group.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 4:27 pm

Private businesses are not required to have a certain number of minorities. They must show a good faith effort to consider minorities more. Or something like that.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 4:28 pm

Yes. The 14th amendment doesn't apply to "only THE blacks." That changes nothing. It's still an insensitive statement that carries a sense of superiority.

political Georgia
10/15/13 4:39 pm

Actually if a private business is working on a city job, the city looks to make sure the contractor has a certain number of minorities.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:39 pm

Well, that isn't quite what the 14th amendment does. The case before the Court right now is about a law passed in Michigan that prohibits colleges from considering race IN ANY MANNER in college admissions decisions. The result is that minority

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:40 pm

enrollment has decreased dramatically. I admit I haven't had time to study the case, but I do know that strict scrutiny is applied to laws if racially discriminatory intent or effect can be shown -- I'm guessing that those challenging the law have

political Georgia
10/15/13 4:41 pm

I have not heard the whole speech delivered by Scalia..... I just heard this clip that Beach created the poll about.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:41 pm

asked the Court to apply strict scrutiny to the law, which would mean that it must be the least restrictive means of accomplishing a compelling government interest. Equality is certainly compelling, but the restrictive prong is tougher.

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:35 am

You are spot on Beach see my comments
Above.

bringstheeagle Colorado
10/16/13 12:42 am

I'm thinking that while your statement about black and Hispanic votes going to Obama is not racist it is incorrect. Didn't Obama get elected by a majority white vote?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/16/13 6:23 am

Obama got the lowest percentage of the white vote of any president in the history of the country.

Carter and Clinton were close, though. But one might have received around the same percentage. Don't quote me on this.

arste New York
10/17/13 5:12 am

Actually I was reading that most African-Americans prefer to be called black. I don't see racism here but perhaps is just because I'm white.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/17/13 5:43 am

Yes, I know black folk like to be called black. That, however, was not the question. You'll have to reread the question, and focus on the all caps part of the question.

susanr Colorado
10/15/13 2:07 pm

I'd like to say "possibly" but I don't think I would have had that thought at all, based on that one statement. Or at least I'd need more context. Or something.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:14 pm

Well I could include quotes from his history as a justice that would better example his racist thoughts.

rolltribe Ohio
10/15/13 2:16 pm

He said the voting rights act is a "racial entitlement."

He's racist

susanr Colorado
10/15/13 2:19 pm

Beach - You could, and then I might change my vote. But based, as I stated, on that one quote, I wouldn't.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:24 pm

"THE blacks" is an antiquated term used to define THOSE people. The people that were below you. It has no place coming out of the mouth of a Supreme Court justice's mouth.

skinner Jersey City
10/15/13 2:07 pm

Only the blacks... I honestly don't get it. Is there something offensive about that?

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eLucidate writing
10/15/13 2:04 pm

Scalia is an idiot, as evidenced by everything he says.

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DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 1:57 pm

They're black. Get over it! I refuse to say the politically correct term because not all blacks have African heritage. Actually, a very significant percentage (some would argue most) is from the Caribbean, not Africa.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:02 pm

They are black. But you don't say "the blacks came in and bought a sweet tea." Or "those blacks drove past me earlier." You're not understanding the question. The fact he said "THE blacks." "The blacks will be the death of this country."

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:05 pm

I agree with your statement, but that's not what my question asked.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 2:07 pm

"The blacks statistically have a higher conviction rate over whites." Is that racist?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:11 pm

It's not the most professional way of putting it, but what he said is different.

kscott516 Masks fail
10/15/13 2:14 pm

Would "only black people" change the meaning for you?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:19 pm

He's a Supreme Court justice that is supposedly smarter than all of us. I would wish he would learn acceptable ways to put things.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 2:20 pm

Beach, just change your tampon and quit being offended just for the sale of being offended. You're not even black.

kscott516 Masks fail
10/15/13 2:23 pm

Why do you think that an appointed, or elected, position for that matter is smarter than the population? They're just human beings like anyone else...but with connections.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:25 pm

I'm half black, raised in a black ghetto, living in a majority black city. I think I have a right to be offended.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:25 pm

@kscott, you're right. I should smarter than most. I wouldn't have the patience to study all the material he's had to study.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:26 pm

Well, I'll say black neighborhood. It really wasn't that bad. But I was the closest thing to white it had.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 2:26 pm

Hahahahah!!!!! Ohhh!! BAHAHAHAHHA!!!!!! Beach! You're too funny bro! You have a right to be offended because you're half black??? HAHAHHAAHHAHAHA! That's rich. Change your bloody tampon and worry about shit that matters bro!

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:29 pm

Alright. I already determined you were racist a long time ago. It's all coming back to me.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:10 pm

DAuflick, whence your obsession with tampons? Do you think that implying someone is a woman is inherently insulting?

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 3:14 pm

Oh bless your heart Ms. Bethany. You must also get offended at everything under the sun. Such a shame because it's so much nicer to just not be offended.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:18 pm

I wasn't offended, cupcake, I was asking a question. Surely you're not afraid to answer a question from a little lady, now, are you?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:21 pm

He doesn't respect minorities including women. It's pointless.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:35 pm

I think I scared him, Beach ;-) I do often intimidate men who aren't used to seeing women as equals.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 3:35 pm

Well no Ms. Bethany. It's just a known fact that when women are on their time of the month, their hormones make them irrational and emotional (for most women). I was just making the statement that Beach is acting similarly to a woman PMSing.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 3:37 pm

Haha! Now Ms. Bethany, you should really learn that judging someone based off of someone else's opinion is not a sound form of judgement. I would recommend you get to know me and then decide for yourself.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:43 pm

"It is known"? You happen to have a cite for that sweeping generalization? If it makes you feel better, I apologize for assuming you were scared. It seems, instead, that you may just be ill-informed -- something I'm always happy to help folks remedy!

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 3:45 pm

Oh bless your heart Ms. Bethany! I wish that you wouldn't be so confrontational just for the sake of being so.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:53 pm

Me, confrontational? Oh, sweetie. Don't let the "California" location fool you: I'm well aware that "bless your heart" is Southern for "fuck you." So let's not pretend, sugar, that I'm the one being confrontational here. Frankly, I'd have had more

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:54 pm

respect for you if you'd had the moral courage to come right out and say what you meant. By the way, I'll take your non-response as a "no." Oh, also - U of Toronto recently published this: news.utoronto.ca/pms-may-not-exist-research-shows

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 3:55 pm

Hope I didn't hurt your brain too much with that dose of confrontational facts!

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 3:59 pm

While "bless your heart" isn't flattering, it is not "fuck you." It is that you're being slightly idiotic. And since we're being frank, I think you're an idiot trying to start shit just for the sake of starting shit. Also, this study is unfounded...

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 4:01 pm

Because, unlike you, I don't believe everything I read just because some liberal college published a study that defies general knowledge. You and I both know that women (buy in large) act crazy I the rag. If you don't want to acknowledge that, ...

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 4:01 pm

Then you're choosing ignorance. I don't know what's more sad. Another SoH user choosing ignorance, or you trying to be hard with a bullshit study. Both are equally sad.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:06 pm

So, wait. You're actively rejecting a peer-reviewed, published, academic survey simply because you disagree with the results? That's called "cognitive dissonance," FYI, and it makes YOU the irrational one -- without even a uterus to blame.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:08 pm

Also, I don't "buy" anything "in large," and certainly not the baseless, unsupported assumptions of some angry, name-calling dude who pouts and lashes out when called out for saying blatantly sexist things.

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 4:09 pm

Look Ms. Bethany. You seem like a smart woman. But I'm not going to accept a study just because it's peer reviewed. Studies are done constantly over the stupidest topics just for the sake of doing then. There are studies that "prove" artificial...

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 4:12 pm

Sweetener gives you cancer, studies that "prove" marijuana causes cancer, and studies that "prove" cell phones will give you brain tumors. I'm not discrediting the study just for the sake of discrediting it. Personally I don't care. I can't....

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
10/15/13 4:13 pm

Believe you're putting this much effort into me telling Beach to change his tampon. It's a phrase. Get over it. You want to wake up and ask yourself "what can I get offended at today?" then that's your prerogative. I'm done with this conversation.

bethanyq Ess Eff
10/15/13 4:19 pm

I'm not putting in any more effort than you are. It's always struck me as odd, this rhetorical race to care the least. What on earth is that meant to prove? Regardless, you're the one making claims about something "everyone knows," without evidence.

ModerateGOP26 Maine
10/15/13 1:57 pm

It sounds like something an older person would say and I totally get what you're getting at, but when you really think about it ... How is that racist at all?

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DavesNotHere where am I
10/15/13 1:59 pm

An older person? Is 'black' the new 'colored'?

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:01 pm

Does he need to say "boy" next. I don't care how old he is. Times change, and that would be considered racist by today's measurements. It's just one small example from a page full of racist things he's said before.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 2:05 pm

And if he's still saying that because of age, then he doesn't need to be one of the most powerful people in the country right now.

skinner Jersey City
10/15/13 2:13 pm

No I honestly don't understand. Is it racist to call someone black?

DavesNotHere where am I
10/15/13 2:28 pm

I say black. I've never considered that a racist or derogatory term. And I'll continue to say it until a black person requests that I stop. It's not racist just because a younger generation says it is.

political Georgia
10/15/13 2:54 pm

Beach: "Oh, f**k it."
Do you need to calm down? Did someone tinkle in your cup of tea? If you can't handle Skinner asking you to clarify your question, I would suggest to not ask a question that would make your blood boil if someone as a different

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
10/15/13 3:05 pm

Because he needs to use common sense. Where is MJ? This is perfect for his "is common sense common" poll. How the fuck is "black" racist? Of course it's not!!!!!!! That has nothing to do with the question.

skinner Jersey City
10/15/13 5:43 pm

Okay then it's not black. So you're either angry at "the" or "only". Which one is it?

osouless Whats Next
10/15/13 1:56 pm

We're all racist in some way. No one treats EVERYONE equally.

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