Show of Hands

Other presidents before him.

Lol ok...lol

Judge Judy

Many more dems here than in the past

The poll is intended to find out if there's a large voting difference between the usual polls pro vs contra Trump (you can dislike a president even if you think he's doing an "ok" job) and a claim of general incompetence.
Seems there isn't.

I expected fewer people to claim absolute incompetence than there are people just not supporting Trump/his policy.
Seems I was wrong.

You know what the Dems are going to vote. What about independent/rep/lib percentages?

The independent figures look rather higher for incompetence than I expected, and Libertarian a bit lower despite my take they're generally more on the Republican side, but the results are little different from a poll asking Dem/Rep affiliation.

Conclusion: partisan leaning or affiliation trumps everything else.

Partisan antipathy is a strong force, unfortunately.

That's kind of why I asked what that matters.

It doesn't really matter what qualities he does or doesn't have... I don't know if it will for any president again, honestly.

All that matters is what team they claim to play for.

I've found that the independent group here is generally a good representation of the general point of view, probably because it's the most mixed group, ideologically.

I’ve found that over the last 3 years, independents have shifted from being 50/50 with Republicans and Democrats, or mostly leaning toward Democrats to almost always being majority with Republicans and Libertarians, for the most part, with only Dems the opposite of everyone else! I think that’s an indication that Dems have gone so far off the left wing cliff that moderate Dems are siding more with the right!

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I can't say I've made the same observation.

Start paying attention to it. It even happens in polls that have nothing to do with politics many times! It’s kind of hilarious, because even on things that aren’t political or religious, Dems seem to have a different mindset from the rest of us, for the most part.

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I didn't say I wasn't paying attention.

I knew I should have worded that differently! What I meant is to start looking at them with what I’ve said in mind, to see if you recognize that pattern now that I’ve mentioned it. Kind of like when you buy a new car and then you see that brand all over the road! 😂🤣😂 You don’t notice them before, but since that vehicle has now been brought to your attention, you begin to see them all over!

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How many billions of dollars have you made?

Stoney, now that's a brilliant argument.

A lot of ppl have more money than me, but I also don't know anyone who was born into money. Trump was born on third base and pretends he hit a home run. You know what intelligent rich people do?...they don't bankrupt as many businesses as trump has....for fuck sake, the guy couldn't keep a casino running...the biggest profit margin in business (casinos) wasn't enough to counter his stupidity...he's incompetent.

The largest, or should I say 'bigliest', problem with trump supporters is that they refuse to admit he's dumb.

He's dumb, deal with it, Bush was dumb and he embraced it but trump is dumb as fuck and his supporters want us to think he's playing chess. That mother fucker is too busy wiping big Mac sauce off his tie to be worried about America.

Whatever you say little fella.

Really how many Billion have you or your family made

I’m 17

🤣😂🤣😂

How does he behave?

That guy—- once again cannot articulate a statement. Very interesting !

I say if he’s incompetent and can bring back manufacturing, lower the unemployment rate to the lowest since the 60’s, and black and Hispanic unemployment to the lowest EVER, I say let’s elect MORE incompetent businessmen! And that’s EXACTLY why politicians are fighting him tooth and nail....because they’re TERRIFIED that all of us will realize that and vote them all out! This is what we needed....a president with a degree in economics instead of a former lawyer!!!

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💠 praetorianus asked:
11/06/2019
Do you think Donald Trump is incompetent and unfit for the office he holds?

He's also reached the highest debt in history....

Well of course. Every president adds more debt to that of the presidents before them. That’s the cost of doing business.

What about the Secretary of the Treasury? What about the Federal Reserve? What about the natural progression of the economy under a capitalist system? Why is everyone always so hyper-focused on the president when it comes to the economy when there are so many other factors to consider, many of which are definitely more significant than the sitting president?

I would normally agree with you, Talren, because other presidents have been former lawyers and politicians. But this one has a degree in economics and really knows what he’s doing.

Let’s put it this way. Under NO OTHER president have I seen the economy doing this well. We’ve just been sinking lower and lower. So I ask you why those groups never did anything under any OTHER president, if they’re the ones in control?!

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Trump hasn't accomplish a thing within the US since taking office. He's a total failure. Mitch has moved anything he has wanted to through fruition, and let's Trump take credit.

So yes, he's definitely incompetent. Whether he's unfit, we'll learn as the impeachment inquiry moves forward. It's not looking good for him though.

⚡

Y’all remember when conservatives dismissed rising debt under Obama as just “the cost of doing business”? 🤔

“But this one has a degree in economics and really knows what he’s doing.”

What does that have to do with all the other factors I mentioned? How do you know it isn’t the Fed you should be praising? They have better control over our economy anyway, since they are free to implement monetary policy however they like without fear of being voted out because their policies aren’t expansionary enough.

Not to mention the fact that boom and bust cycles are inherent to a capitalist economy and will always happen independently of what the president does.

I’m sorry, but it’s just terrible practice to assume the sitting president is automatically responsible for the current state of the economy. He has more than a negligible effect sure, but because there are so many other factors, a poor economy can very easily happen under an excellent president, and a booming economy can very easily happen under a terrible president, so it’s a terrible metric to use to judge a president’s competency.

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Like I said, why haven’t they been doing it before now? Our economy has just been going down and down, with the loss of manufacturing jobs, and people in the heartland hurting. And you think that they suddenly turned it all around when it just so happens that Trump is president? I think not. They’re not the ones that gave companies tax cuts. They’re not the ones that renegotiated trade deals. They’re not the ones that deregulated. They’re not the ones that passed the Perkins Career and Technical Education Act.

And they’re not the ones that came up with President Trump’s Pledge to America’s Workers, an effort to encourage the private sector to create new training opportunities for workers across our nation.   

MORE

With the leadership of Advisor to the President Ivanka Trump, the Pledge has secured commitments from more than 300 companies and organizations—translating to over 14 million education and training opportunities for students and workers alike.

Learn more about President Trump’s Pledge to America’s Workers:

www.whitehouse.gov/pledge-to-americas-workers/?utm_source=ods&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=1600d

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DJ13, the House controls the purse. Which party controls the House?

Like I said, boom and bust cycles are inherent to a capitalist economy and will always happen no matter what the president does. You can’t just make the economy boom whenever you like as long as you have a degree in economics and know what you’re doing. That’s not how the economy works. At best, you can implement expansionary and contractionary policies when necessary to keep the economy stable. And the Federal Reserve is naturally much better at doing this than the government, because the government is constrained by its voters, who are always going to respond favorably to expansionary fiscal policies and critically to contractionary ones, even when expansionary policies may not be what’s best for the economy at that time.

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So essentially, the job of controlling the economy is split between the government and the Fed, the latter of which is naturally better at it, and then said job is further split in the government between the president, the Secretary of the Treasury, and Congress, AND nothing any of these people do can prevent the natural boom and bust cycles of the economy, only keep it relatively stable. And you’re saying that because Trump just so happened to be the sitting president while we’re in a boom cycle, he is singlehandedly responsible for everything being great. Do you see yet why this is such a weak argument?

Maybe instead of praising the sitting president whenever the economy is booming and getting mad at him whenever it’s in the shitter, we should be worrying about the fact that capitalism causes its economies to crash every decade or so.

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Like I said, with any other president, I would agree with you. But I listed all the things that Trump has done that no other president has. We’ll just have to agree to disagree on this one.

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Except what I’m saying applies invariably no matter who the president is or what he’s done differently.

Exactly guy, it's called hypocrisy....

4jc, then you agree, Trump is responsible for the US debt.....

He’s responsible for the debt in the same way that any other president is responsible for the debt, DJ.

For example, I’ve heard that Obama tripled the debt, and racked up more debt than all the other presidents before him combined.

I don’t know what people don’t understand about this. The BIGGER the federal government gets, the more they take decisions and programs away from the states, the MORE money they’re going to need every year to run this behemoth of a government! Add to that the cost of inflation, and it’s a given that it will rise with every president, imho.

If the next Democratic president pushes us into socialism, you ain’t seen NOTHIN’ yet!!!!

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Not all debt is created equal. Obama used it to stimulate the economy during the Great Recession and help those hurt by it. Trump used it to make the rich richer and waste more on the military.

So, are you saying since the debt was going up already when Trump took office, he doesn't get the full blame for how high it is now?

Thatguy, I don’t know ANYONE that was helped by Obama...only those that were hurt by him when their insurance premiums doubled, tripled and quadrupled under ACA, so that they had to DROP their insurance and pay a fine because they couldn’t afford payments higher than their house payments!

What Trump has done has helped ALL people including blacks and Hispanics. If you’re not doing well in this economy, you’re doing something wrong! His tax breaks have especially helped small businesses that were spending up to one HALF of their income on taxes! We’re doing better than we’ve done in 15 years!

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Yes, DJ, and I know where you’re going with this. I believe the same thing about the economy. Obama had made a little headway with the economy, and it was rising some, though not to the steep extent that it has since Trump passed tax cuts and deregulation and better trade deals. Obama’s recovery from a recession was the slowest of any president in the history of the US. But he does get SOME credit.

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The economy grew much more under Obama than it has under Trump. All numbers prove that.... Don't raise Trump's performance up to the point of worship....

I’m not worshipping anyone. I just know the truth when I see it, both in the news and in local towns where plants are being built, and everyone I know is doing better. You can’t argue with the lowest black and Hispanic unemployment rate EVER, and the lowest unemployment rate for the general population since the 60’s!

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Unemployment dropped, the stock market grew, and more people had health insurance under Obama but you can’t think of ANYONE that benefited, eh? Fascinating

What’s the point of having health insurance if you can’t afford to use it?

No, thatguy, the entire HEARTLAND was hurting. I know that elites on the coast can’t understand that, but it’s what got Trump elected to begin with!

As I said, all the people that I knew that had been paying for health insurance for DECADES had their premiums double, triple or quadruple. Ours doubled. But we have friends that had to drop insurance completely and go to a Christian sharing plan. Thankfully, they’re healthy and can do that. We just got our quarterly report for just prescription drug charges. Our meds for 3 months ran over $47K and we paid less than $750 for it!

And I don’t think you can compare unemployment dropping to unemployment being at the lowest in HALF A DECADE!

We’re should just agree to disagree on this one.

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Really, you can't compare the unemployment dropping to the lowest in 50 yrs.... Are you serious.. It wouldn't be this low if Obama didn't reverse the trend and started LOWERING IT....The unemployment dropped about 6%-7% under Obama. How far has it dropped under Trump...

I give Obama credit for starting it, but the HEARTLAND was still SUFFERING when Trump was elected, and Dems like HRC were PROMISING to put more people out of work. I saw big burly men on tv, SOBBING, saying that they just wanted to feed their families and saying that the US had FORGOTTEN them! That’s why the Rust Belt voted for DJT. It’s why MANY people voted for him.

And Obama also laughed at Trump and said it would take a magic wand to bring back manufacturing and we’ve seen Trump do that very thing. I see plants being built in small towns that really needed them. I know that the Heartland might not be important to you and small towns might not be important to you, but they are to me!

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Falling unemployment and a rising stock market only helped “elites on the coast” under Obama but now magically benefits everyone. 😂 Man, the mental gymnastics are crazy.

What do you not understand about the heartland suffering and Dems saying they would put more of us out of jobs? Small towns had been decimated by NAFTA. Trump is bringing those jobs back after Obama said it was IMPOSSIBLE.

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So dropping the unemployment 6%-7% is worth SOME credit, but dropping it 1% is worth worshipping.....got it...

I keep telling you this is about the HEARTLAND. Red states have averaged twice as big an unemployment drop under Trump as blue states!!!

www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/02/23/red-states-have-averaged-twice-as-big-an-unemployment-drop-under-trump-as-blue-states/

You see, you’re not taking into account that the unemployment rate in red states (the heartland) was much higher than in blue states because we had been decimated by a government that traded away our jobs! And HRC was promising to do away with even more of them. I know people that had to go out of state to find work under Obama that got their jobs in AL back not long after Trump was elected, due to his deregulations.

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And even some black Millennials are beginning to recognize what Trump has done for them. Check out this article about their 4 day conference. Of course, you won’t see this on liberal media because it doesn’t advance their agenda:

www.foxnews.com/politics/young-black-conservatives-unite-around-president-trump?fbclid=IwAR2JOIxmFLWWHGyTkM0lKt1JvDEA_CRdm4tgzuOgPtgCouWrnSga6k9oBBs

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I have other links about blacks, Hispanics and Independents that are now supporting Trump because of what they see him doing to help them. I can link those to you later if you want. They’re from sites like Real Clear Politics, USA Today, Metro Voice News, etc.

But I’m about to leave for church now, so it will be several hours before I respond.

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www.nbcnews.com/news/nbcblk/poll-black-latino-americans-think-donald-trump-s-actions-have-n1062821

I never said that ALL blacks support Trump. We know the vast majority of them don’t, because they’ve been brainwashed by the Dems since Johnson, and kept on his ghetto plantations, allowing the government to destroy their families. But there are SOME that ARE beginning to get wise to the Dems schemes, and are seeing that Trump has helped them. Like I said, I have multiple articles about this, if you wish to read them.

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And of course, these conservative blacks are being called horrible names by Dems for thinking for themselves!

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Brainwashed by getting civil rights. What a bunch of fools.

Brainwashed to vote Dem to keep their government ghetto plantations, living in slavery, never allowed to live where they want, told how much they can spend on food every month, and that the men must leave the women high and dry so the government will pay for the babies they should be paying for themselves. I can send a long list of links about this if you don’t believe me, including several from black leaders.

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Thanks for sharing your racist views.

What is racist is Dems that have kept blacks under their control, determining where they can live, how much food they can buy, and destroying their families. I’m in favor of black people having jobs, living where they want to live, buying whatever food they want, and succeeding!

MORE

Larry Elder—how the war on poverty and the lack of fathers in the home has hurt:

youtu.be/FszQelEQ2KY

Thomas Sowell on Welfare and Slavery:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=uF0bguf2E74&feature=youtu.be

www.nytimes.com/1983/11/20/us/breakup-of-black-family-imperils-gains-of-decades.html?pagewanted=all

atlantablackstar.com/2014/12/24/ways-war-poverty-destroyed-black-fatherhood/

www.wnd.com/2014/01/war-on-poverty-splitting-up-black-families/

www.discoverthenetworks.org/viewSubCategory.asp?id=1672

www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/262726/how-liberal-welfare-state-destroyed-black-america-john-perazzo

www.nationalreview.com/article/440412/tdemocrats-favoring-blacks-has-only-hurt-them-culturally-and-politically

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I’m in favor of blacks being able to think for themselves instead of being told they have to believe a certain way, just because they’re black. And I’m against Dems that call them vile names because they speak their minds!

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Thanks for sharing your racist views.

Only a liberal would accuse blacks of having racist views against themselves!

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Are you not in favor of blacks having jobs, being able to determine where they live, how much food they can buy, etc? What in all of that is racist?

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It’s always funny to see the same people that tell us black people are to dumb to figure out how to get an ID card also calling others racist.

EXACTLY, Stoney! And black people think they’re idiots, too! They’re incredulous that some white people think they’re too stupid to get an ID, which they’ve had since they were in high school! 🙄🙄🙄

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Kick that strawman’s ass! Finally a fight y’all can win.

Says the person that can’t add to the convo and only lobs ad hominem attacks.

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You’re a lost cause. You’ll be a lying racist until you die. Nothing I can do about it. Lucky for you, Hell’s not real. Be thankful.

Again, with the ad hominem attacks. That’s all you have. You can’t add to the convo, can you?

I chimed in after you (above) and am wondering what you think about my theory.

4JC ... I just saw your comments above and absolutely agree with you!

Thanks for sharing!

Thanks, Think! You’re welcome!