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TheMusicMan February 14th, 2019 12:06am

Opposing Israeli policies is NOT antisemitism. Opposing the occupation is NOT antisemitism. Opposing the nation state law is NOT antisemitism. BDS is NOT antisemitism. Solidarity with Palestinians is NOT antisemitism. Antizionism is NOT antisemitism.

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TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/15/19 4:17 pm

Disagree with the concepts, or disagree that they aren't anti-Semitic?

chinito Florida
02/15/19 4:18 pm

Many of those things are antisemitic.

chinito Florida
02/16/19 5:08 am

Opposing Israel’s policies is not antisemite. That is of course if you are talking about their stance in gay marriage, gun control, safety net, draft... but I suspect you are talking about Israel’s right to defend itself. That of course is antisemite.


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chinito Florida
02/16/19 5:09 am

Saying there is an occupation is twisting the history. The Arabs attacked Israel because they wanted to wipe Jews and destroy Israel. Israel somehow won the war and in a defensive maneuver ended up conquering territories. Since then, they have returned most of that land (more than half its territory) in exchange for peace. They did it with Egypt and Jordan. Of course, they tried to do it with the Palestinians. They even gave them Gaza without asking for anything in return. Palestinians then elected Hamas and started a terror campaign against Israelis civilians. You should understand Israel cannot just abandon the West Bank. It would be fatal. Also, can you explain me what is wrong with the settlements? Almost a quarter of Israel’s population are Arabs (who enjoy the same rights). Why Jews cannot live in Palestine? Arabs already made ethnic cleansing in most of their countries and Gaza. Why are you arguing that they should also be able to do ethnic cleansing in the WB as well?



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chinito Florida
02/16/19 5:09 am

There are I believe 27 Islamic states and 13 Christian states. There is only 1 Jewish state. Opposing Israel being a Jewish state (even though people are free to practice any religion), and not oppose the other 40 countries with an official religion is definitely antisemite.

Supporting BDS and not boycotting countries that really violate human rights (and Palestine) is antisemite. I don’t see many people boycotting China or Saudi Arabia.



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TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/16/19 9:03 am

I'm not saying they don't have a right to defend themselves. Who are they defending from though? The Palestinians that they're killing in their open-air prison (Gaza)? I'm talking strictly about their policies and primarily AIPAC. Anti-BDS laws are unconstitutional (anti 1A), Christian or Jewish or Muslim state - doesn't matter - theocracies are horrible models and I rail on the others equally because they deserve to be criticized for oppressive behaviors as well. BDS worked in South Africa, Israel is lobbying and paying our politicians to hold favor and keep quiet about Palestine's struggles, and now with AIPAC they're making it illegal to speak out against it. People are losing their jobs because they don't blindly stand behind Israel (case of the teacher in Texas comes to mind first). It is not anti-Semitic to criticize all policies fairly, nor is it anti-Semitic to call out Israel's bribery of US politicians.

chinito Florida
02/16/19 10:43 am

They are defending themselves from the Arabs nations that attacked them several times without provocation and from the terrorists around them. They are defending themselves from the suicide bombers that blow themselves is bus stops. From the radicals that stab women walking down the street. From the terrorists that shoot thousands of rockets to civilian cities. They are defending themselves from people arming themselves while chanting they want to destroy Israel. That teach their children that Allah wants them to kill Jews. From terrorist groups that explicit put in their Charter that they want to kill every Jew. They are defending themselves from the people that give money to the families of terrorists and build them statues. Any question?

chinito Florida
02/16/19 11:03 am

Israel is not a theocracy. Freedom of religion is protected in their constitution. About a quarter of Israelis are Arabs. They enjoy the same freedoms and rights as anyone else. They can pray whomever they want in peace. They can also work, vote, receive welfare, serve in the army, even run for office. It’s funny that Israel is the only country in the region that protects freedom of religion and it’s the only one you are criticizing and boycotting. And you don’t even know about how many countries call themselves Christian. Excuse me if I don’t buy it when you say it’s not anti-semitism.

chinito Florida
02/16/19 11:10 am

Israel is not paying any politician. AIPAC is lobbying. If you have problems with lobbyists then you should argue that it should end FOR EVERYONE. Again, you are using a double standard and only talking about the group that fits your narrative.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/16/19 11:36 am

You're assuming I am. Lobbying to buy politicians needs to stop. Money in politics needs to stop. But this specific poll and what it's focusing on is Israel using AIPAC to lobby and buy US votes. And if you don't think that's the case, then you're either unaware and uninformed or willfully ignorant.

chinito Florida
02/16/19 12:17 pm

OK. Lets boycott unions and Planned Parenthood until they stop lobbying. Do you agree?

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/16/19 12:28 pm

So you're comparing boycotting basic human rights with boycotting war, war crimes, and selling weapons/training other countries to be more oppressive? Just further proof that you have no idea what the f*ck you're talking about. 👍

chinito Florida
02/16/19 6:28 pm

Until now I have only point your inconsistencies. You are OK with a lot of things unless they are done by Israel. That’s why I don’t buy it when people say “it’s not Anti-Semitism”.

Israel is not what you accuse it to be. You are twisting the truth and taking things out of context to prove a point. But yeah, you keep trashing Israel, using 2 different standards, turning a blind eye to whatever doesn’t fit your narrative... and all of that to convince me “it is not Anti-Semitism”.

thedman Free Kyle Rittenhouse
02/13/19 8:16 pm

Not everyone that holds those beliefs are anti-semitic, but if you’re anti-Semitic you hold those beliefs.

ovcourse California, FJB
02/13/19 5:40 pm

What occupation?

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ovcourse California, FJB
02/13/19 5:54 pm

All justified. Go blow your horn somewhere else musicman.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 5:56 pm

Justified? An illegal occupation and genocide is justified? Please, explain.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 5:59 pm

I mean, for f*ck's sake, did you even READ anything I posted? Or are you just ok with occupation and genocide?

ovcourse California, FJB
02/13/19 6:42 pm

Except, there is neither an occupation nor genocide. You’re clearly an anti Semite.

TwinJefe Pacific Northwest
02/13/19 6:46 pm

Considering Palestinians had to flee their homes in 1948 and haven’t been allowed to return, and since millions still live in refugee camps in several neighboring countries, it’s safe to say that these people got screwed and now live in terrible conditions.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 7:05 pm

@ovcourse I've provided evidence and facts backing my side of the argument. Where is your evidence that there isn't an occupation or worse?

Also, citation needed on calling me anti-Semitic 😂 good luck with that.

ovcourse California, FJB
02/13/19 7:51 pm

You’ve posted articles, not facts. Opinions you and other radicals hold. That’s all!

ovcourse California, FJB
02/13/19 7:53 pm

LOL “refuge camps”. They are cities.

TwinJefe Pacific Northwest
02/13/19 8:10 pm

Nope, many live in Refugee “districts” or “camps” in extreme poverty. Look at some of the Lebanese or Jordanian Palestinian refugee camps, they are absolute poverty.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 8:24 pm

Right dude, articles that hold facts - it's not my fault if you're too dense to read.

zimmy Florida
02/13/19 5:31 pm

Agree with all except anti-Zionism, to be against a Jewish State is like being against a French State, British, German, Egyptian ext.... so being anti Zionist is being anti Jewish.

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TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 5:34 pm

I understand where you're coming from with that, but my opinion (for what it's worth) is that antizionism is more of an anti-religious state, not particularly exclusive to any religion or group. A French state or Spanish state is very different because that is a state of those people - the people as a whole, not an ideology or anything like a proposed Jewish state.

zimmy Florida
02/13/19 7:01 pm

But the Jewish People are also like an ethnic group. That’s where it just is not religious.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 8:26 pm

Does that make the Palestinians "lesser" though?

Odysseus We All Need A Fantasy
02/13/19 5:20 pm

It is actually Pro Israel.

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TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 5:22 pm

Opposing Israel and their policies is pro-Israel?

Odysseus We All Need A Fantasy
02/13/19 5:25 pm

Opposition to the current Israeli governmental policies would be Pro Israel in my opinion.

zimmy Florida
02/13/19 5:32 pm

Yeah not a fan of the Netenyahu government, but pro-Israel the nation.

TheMusicMan Community not Capital
02/13/19 5:36 pm

Wait, so help me understand better (got a headache so everything is kinda fuzzy honestly) - what you guys are saying is oust the current leadership but still support the country (and good luck, Palestine, figure it out on your own)? So basically, Brazil or Venezuela the situation?

zimmy Florida
02/13/19 6:59 pm

No not at all, I hate the American government right now, under the Trump regime, but I still support America as a whole. A different government in Israel might try and make peace with the Palestinians, but Palestinian leadership is also flawed at this time.