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TheMusicMan January 31st, 2019 10:48am

Did you know: ending the estate tax would give a tax break of up to $63B for the Walton family, $39B for the Koch brothers, $27B for the Mars (candy) family, $13B for the Cox (cable) family, and $0 for more than 99.8% of Americans?

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ronderman North Carolina
01/31/19 7:24 pm

99.8% of Americans unfairly don’t pay that tax. Make it fair and make it so that EVERYONE pays 40% taxes on all estate inheritance. That would put a huge dent in the deficit and people can’t say it’s unfair anymore.

MusicMan, put your money where your mouth is.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 7:35 pm

What estate tax do you suggest we impose on the huge percentage of people who have nothing to pass on or be taxed? How's that work out?

ronderman North Carolina
01/31/19 8:08 pm

Well, the estate tax covers anyone with 11ish million to pass down, right? Let’s make that figure 1.00.

With every death, the federal government gets 50% of the estate. If you die with more debt than assets, then you win and the government gets nothing. If you die with a dollar to your name, the govt gets fifty cents.

Seems simple.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 8:13 pm

If that's how you think it works, then keep on trucking. TFG.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
02/01/19 10:11 am

I beg of you to read these. Don't skim, don't glance at the title and blow it off because "ugh, f*cking tax crazy liberal," but actually read these through. They explain the tax better than I ever could, they address small businesses and farms, they express the pros and cons of the estate tax and the misunderstanding/fear behind it - you should walk away from this at least understanding it even if you still don't support it.

www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/ten-facts-you-should-know-about-the-federal-estate-tax

www.economist.com/leaders/2017/11/23/a-hated-tax-but-a-fair-one

www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/11/the-very-bad-arguments-for-killing-the-estate-tax/545633/

www.bloomberg.com/quicktake/the-estate-tax

americansfortaxfairness.org/tax-fairness-briefing-booklet/fact-sheet-the-estate-inheritance-tax/

www.calculator.net/estate-tax-calculator.html (to see if you even fall within the limits or are exempt)

ronderman North Carolina
02/01/19 10:52 am

Ok. So I read the first three articles but I’m out of time. Some of my statistics were different, but my premise is the same.

Why not make everyone pay it? If it’s good for the 5M+ estates, why not tax estates that pass on 5k? Tax everybody the same. Stop picking on the top bracket. That’s my argument.

Now, let’s try an experiment. Let’s see if you can respond without cursing. I think you can do it if you put your mind to it. I’m quite enjoying the conversation and I might even learn something.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
02/01/19 11:37 am

Oh come on SoH, stop cutting people off. You can finish that thought when you have time, but "cursing" is just how I speak in day to day life too. I'm an adult, I'm allowed to express myself without word restrictions, so I do. I get it's not for everyone, but it helps for me.

I agree in general that taxes should apply to everyone, but it was my understanding that those who aren't millionaires and/or the upper brackets are typically too poor to really pass on anything as it is, and that's if they don't put their family in debt just trying to cover the funeral costs. Death isn't cheap as it is for the poor/middle class. Why would you tax those who don't have it to be taxed and argue that those who do have the means shouldn't be taxed?

bnnt Los Angeles
01/31/19 2:37 pm

So what. Their families earned that.

The government already taxed it when it was earned, when saved, and not to mention the loads of sales taxes made from selling their products.

The government should have never initiated a “death tax” at the onset. It’s total robbery to take and then redistribute for a politicians whim.

Reply
ctskapski NB MD
01/31/19 2:47 pm

The family earned that money by
*squints at hand*
"Being born into the right family."

bnnt Los Angeles
01/31/19 2:59 pm

Ct - so the solution is to forcefully take it? Sounds more like an envy tax.
Somebody in the family earned it, they have every right to keep it.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 3:24 pm

I wish I could just sit on ass and never work a day in my life and earn millions or billions from my slave-driving grand/parents. Man I'd love to outsource my manufacturing and pay 10¢ on the dollar for foreign labor, then deny my American workers rights by lobbying against unions and paying them the absolute bare minimum I'm legally allowed to. F*ck - I would be LOADED with cash.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 3:25 pm

How many billions you got, bnnt? Wanna go yacht racing tonight? Unless you're a little b*tch 😉 I bet all 20 of my yachts are faster and better than any of yours. Amirite?

ctskapski NB MD
01/31/19 5:07 pm

"If one person in a family earns a thing, therefore the others in that family are entitled to it."

I can't say I agree to that particular philosophical precept, friend.

xtarite
01/31/19 11:37 am

The estate tax is completely immoral...unlike being a billionaire, which is NOT immoral

Reply
TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 11:45 am

Bullsh*t. Morality is not objective. Neither being rich nor being taxed is immoral to reasonable people. That being said, hording wealth or keeping it within its own cashflow system while it could better serve millions and keep them from starving or freezing or dying? At the very least that presents an ethical dilemma. In my subjective moral view, it is wrong to hold that much wealth and refuse to help anyone with it even in death. Keeping it "in the family" isn't helping anyone because the family was already well-off as it was.

Scrltt64 Ohio
01/31/19 9:46 am

Besides just being wrong to tax a dead person when they have already been taxed on that money, it also saves countless family farms and small businesses. The people you list will already have planned ways to avoid those taxes anyway. That money belongs to those people. They earned it so why do we treat it like they are taking it from the government anyway.

ctskapski NB MD
01/31/19 9:53 am

Why is it wrong to tax the dead?
What use do they have for money?

thatguy2 I am Antifa
01/31/19 10:22 am

The person that died “earned” it, not the people now receiving it.

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 11:33 am

The dead are dead. Why do they get more respect and rights than some of those currently living and working their asses off? The dead can f*ck right off. They had special treatment in life, once you're gone you're gone, time to move on and help more people than just your entitled kids. Something tells me that if there was a proper tax for this, we wouldn't even have a Trump problem right now 😂

TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 8:12 am

It smells funny in here. Like cheap hookers and vodka and p*ss and disappointment and foreign donations breaking the emoluments clause.

suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/31/19 7:52 am

But...but...the GOP said any one of us 99.8% COULD be a multi-billionaire TOMORROW! Right?

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TheMusicMan Still feeling the Bern
01/31/19 8:05 am

Did you grab your bootstraps hard enough and strangle your family with them? Make sure they leave you their billions of dollars in their will first.

ronderman North Carolina
01/31/19 7:19 pm

I’m not expecting to be a billionaire, I do expect to be a multimillionaire.

Malekithe R lyeh
01/31/19 4:36 am

The tax never should have been levied to begin with.

tractorman Make Good Trouble
01/31/19 8:17 am

This is a tax created to prevent an aristocracy from developing in our nation, something our founding fathers found abhorrent which was practiced in England and much of Europe. America doesn’t want aristocratic families ruling because we are supposed to be a democracy by and for the people....

ctskapski NB MD
01/31/19 9:55 am

Tractorman is, I believe, correct in his explanation.
And I can't say I disagree with that motive, even though some could argue it didn't work.

Malekithe R lyeh
01/31/19 3:36 pm

Taxes which apply to estates or to inheritance in the United States trace back to the 18th century. According to the IRS, a temporary stamp tax in 1797 applied a tax of varying size depending on the size of the bequest, ranging from 25 cents for a bequest between $50 and $100, to 1 dollar for each $500. The tax was repealed in 1802

Malekithe R lyeh
01/31/19 3:37 pm

The modern estate tax was enacted in 1916. The modern estate tax was temporarily phased out and repealed by tax legislation in 2001. This legislation gradually dropped the rates until they were eliminated in 2010. However, the law did not make these changes permanent and the estate tax returned in 2011.