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suppressedID January 30th, 2019 4:24pm

During the government shutdown, Joshua Tree National Park gates stayed open. Vandals cut down rare Joshua trees and damaged rocks, people cut locks and cut new roads out into wilderness. Can people be trusted to do the right thing without oversight?

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mnct Ohio, USA
01/30/19 10:00 pm

The 'without oversight' part was unnecessary. Who will watch the watchers?

John1 Florida
01/30/19 6:29 pm

What your article didn’t tell you is that those things happen even when the government is open. Somehow the other several dozen national parks were okay with the exception of a few over-filled trash cans.

And be fair by attributing the shutdown to both parties. It’s really petty when the blame game goes into effect like middle school children.

When it comes down to it, though, I guess I need the government to be my mommy and make sure I’m a good little boy.

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shygal47 Florida east coast
01/30/19 1:19 pm

It would be interesting to see the make up of the culprits like the Results graphs here. If I have some time later, I’ll see what I can find out for demographics.
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HammeringMan Gods Away On Business
01/30/19 3:29 pm

The vandals were not caught. How can you discover the demographics?

shygal47 Florida east coast
01/30/19 3:42 pm

Police records are public documents unless there is an open case or it’s a juvenile, right?
I would hazard a guess that the perpetrators are young men with more testosterone than brains. And their galpals that think they have to be like their Man.
Why do people today think they can only said to be if they are ruining someone else’s property, or killing someone, ad infinitum.
The demographics would demonstrate age, gender, race, education - think of the marketing possibilities!!
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paranoidandroid beantown scientist lady
01/30/19 5:20 pm

The vandals were not caught. How can you discover the demographics?

shygal47 Florida east coast
01/30/19 6:37 pm

When/if they are. Not everyone committing these actions gets away scot free.

HammeringMan Gods Away On Business
01/31/19 10:36 am

Shy- 1,250 square miles National park.
44 million suspects within driving range
No cameras
1,000 vandalisms
A dozen convictions would not reliably reflect Perps demographics.

shygal47 Florida east coast
01/31/19 12:46 pm

So - you see no value in trying to record statistics in order to identify a specific group of persons more prone to be vandals? A group of malcontents?
Wouldn’t you feel that progress is made if you know your target audience in order to determine ways to alter their behavior? Not every vandal does it because of hate, many do it because they think of being a YouTube star <— that can be changed by hurting them where it hurts - their wallets, or their parents’ wallet.
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HammeringMan Gods Away On Business
01/31/19 8:04 pm

I agree with your intent...but not the method. The 👮 popo are not likely to even have the data you suggest.

adman4285
01/30/19 12:46 pm

I think most people CAN be trusted to do the right thing. It just takes one bad act to change opinion and that is unfair. I do find the level of respect for others and their things has dropped over time and that is a societal issue.

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MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
01/30/19 12:31 pm

That’s really shitty.

But, to your point- unless non-humans are supervising the bad humans, then yes, we have always relied on humans to do the right thing and we often come out just fine.
The problem is that some humans suck.

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apparition Tacoma
01/30/19 12:16 pm

If only there was some kind of physical barrier to protect the the land. Too bad walls are racist tho.

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suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/30/19 12:18 pm

And destroy the environment you’re trying to protect?!? You really don’t understand how ecosystems work, do you?

EarlyBird Portland
01/30/19 11:51 am

This is very disappointing. 😢

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jlong105 Indiana
01/30/19 11:18 am

That’s those California People. No sense out of that state whatsoever

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suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/30/19 12:18 pm

Yeah, because it’s California. 🙄

Kay41 the Midwest
01/30/19 11:09 am

I want to answer yes to this, but I can't. This kind of thing makes me intensely angry.

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historylover
01/30/19 10:52 am

Why were the gates left open? To make it like the southern border?

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Robert01 existentialist
01/30/19 10:43 am

Right and wrong are subjective.

Can people be trust to respect things that dont belong to them - without oversight? No.

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smartfart Florida
01/30/19 10:35 am

The point is sad, but true.
I was a very strict libertarian while in college. Once I got into the real world & saw this generally, I realized how wrong that ideology really is.

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suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/30/19 10:46 am

Had you heard about it?
Is the damage still relevant?
Should we learn something and keep it from happening again?

HammeringMan Gods Away On Business
01/30/19 11:22 am

What does Jan 10 have to do with discussing vandalism?

Ssfiddler1 TheTrumpBarber
01/30/19 9:40 am

Of course not people are stupid

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adman4285
01/30/19 12:42 pm

I don’t think people are stupid. I believe that most people who would have visited the park would have done so respectively.

GlockMan1 Alabama
01/30/19 9:38 am

Look at our Southern border and you will have your answer.

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suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/30/19 9:25 am

Q:
During the government shutdown, Joshua Tree National Park gates stayed open. Vandals cut down rare Joshua trees and damaged rocks, people cut locks and cut new roads out into wilderness. Can people be trusted to do the right thing without oversight?

suppressedID Honor RBGs Wish
01/30/19 9:27 am

Given recovery and regrowth rates, some are saying it will take 200-300 years for those 34 days of abuse.
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