Show of HandsShow of Hands

Show Of Hands November 7th, 2017 6:49pm

On this day in 1944, President Franklin Delano Roosevelt was elected to an unprecedented fourth term in office. Are you a fan of the 22nd Amendment, which formally limits a president to serving no more than two terms?

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613dimples New York
11/19/17 8:59 pm

It's the one mistake the founding fathers made---not establishing term limits for all elected positions

Me4POTUS United States of America
11/10/17 11:26 pm

Damn. This is a tough one.

I voted YES because there have to be limits on everything.

However, if a President is doing a good job and the people approve of him/her, why stop them from leaving office?

Enigma13
Jun 01, 3:45 pm

Because then you have a Julius Caesar, someone who never gave up his power. It’s the fear of a dictatorship or an absolute monarchy being born.

Or at least that’s the idea behind the 22nd Amendment.

TeenRepublican North Carolina
11/10/17 9:25 pm

I do understand the precedent set in place by washington, but if someone is effectively running our country to a great extent, they should be allowed to run for a third and even 4th term. One of our founding fathers thought it would be a good idea if there were no terms for president, and while I don't necessarily agree with the exact way he said it, I understand where he was coming from.

jmuz99 Cleveland, OH
11/08/17 6:38 pm

If people are doing well and being elected by the people repeatedly, why stop them?

wolfsong Full time animal lover
11/08/17 2:48 pm

Yes. We need to extend it to members of congress too.

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hokiejac Decatur, GA
11/08/17 1:10 pm

If I could tweak the 22nd Amendment, I would say no more than two consecutive terms, without a lifetime ban. Once you leave the presidency it would be difficult to return, but it would be nice to be able to recall a former president if necessary.

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thaywth
11/08/17 11:32 am

If I had to endure another four years of Obama, this country, along with my faith in humanity, would have disintegrated to ash.

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Think Lovin Life
11/08/17 12:03 pm

Amen to that!!!

akrealist a log cabin in the woods
11/08/17 6:47 am

Does anyone else find it annoying when left-leaning,anti-Trump SOH questions are masked as something benign? Obamacare (enrollment is up!) Paris accord (shame in the US for taking their ball and going home!) term limits (don’t you wish Obama could have run?) felons to vote (c’mon guys, they’d be overwhelmingly left-leaning right? If we coulda had them, Hill would be our President!)

I suppose SOH can run this as they’d like, I just wish they were a bit more transparent about the bias.

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STEVE64 Michigan
11/08/17 4:46 pm

This question is not at all left or right leaning

STEVE64 Michigan
11/08/17 4:47 pm

Same with the Paris climate question

ehube513 Lebanon PA
11/08/17 9:55 pm

Whichever way “felons” would vote has nothing to do with their right to do so. What about someone who made a mistake 20 years ago but is not a hard working member if society? They’re just not allowed to vote?

ehube513 Lebanon PA
11/08/17 9:56 pm

I️ meant is NOW a hard working part of the community.

akrealist a log cabin in the woods
11/10/17 6:31 am

We’ll have to agree to disagree. I think all of those questions have underlying bias - and I find it to be an annoying trend.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
11/07/17 11:37 pm

No, I don't support term limits.

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DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
11/08/17 3:04 pm

If the people like someone they should be able to vote for him more frequently.

nate19 WI
11/08/17 3:07 pm

It just leaves more room for corruption if you leave someone in the captains seat to long.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
11/08/17 3:14 pm

Then the people can vote for someone else if they want to.

BeachSt Coastal Virginia
11/07/17 8:42 pm

I don't see much need for it. Talk about an overreaction

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otto Olean, NY
11/07/17 8:17 pm

Huge fan of it because of him.

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nacho
11/08/17 7:43 am

Which FDR policy did you Iike best?

The internment of citizens by a Democratic President or the establishment of a permanent welfare stare?

historyqueen
11/08/17 6:36 pm

Some many people blame FDR for the permanent welfare state, when in all actuality it wasn't FDR that got us into that. If you worked on one of the government programs started by the New Deal Program you worked for every dollar you received. Much of today's infrastructure was built and maintained by those programs. Working for one of the New Deal programs is no different than someone working for the federal government today. Had FDR not done something to put people back to work after 12 years of inept leadership of Harding, Coolidge and Hoover we might have grown up in a communist state. The communists were at their highest point in this country during that period and people began to doubt capitalism.
If you want to blame someone for the permanent welfare state blame Lyndon Johnson and his Great Society program. That is when we started to dole out money and benefits like candy.

otto Olean, NY
11/08/17 7:51 pm

@history64

I DO blame LBJ. However, FDR does share some fault in creating our permanent deficits.

Although absolutely true that New Deal programs did indeed require work, that work was paid for by U.S. government (taxpayers) rather than by private sector. So taxes had to be jacked up to cover it and that CRIPPLED the recovery of the private sector. Working or not, New Deal was advent of citizens relying on government and LBJ just blew it up by largely removing the work requirement.

And now, the entire political environment is nothing but inventing more and more hand-outs to promise to the voters. And as more and more people are relieved of their duty to pay taxes (around 50% now), they begin voting for more and more freebies because the “rich” are paying for them with their exorbitant taxes. So it snowballs into socialism after all.

ladyniner81 I hate people
11/09/17 7:56 am

The system was a great idea, but as usual, like the NAACP , VA , welfare or even Medicare, politicians and the general public has abused it. The good people suffer because the abusers exploit it

otto Olean, NY
11/10/17 4:22 am

That ALWAYS happens. Everywhere and every time. Always has, and always will. It is precisely why socialism does not and cannot work, and why, no, it was NOT a good idea. In a fantasy utopia it would be, but not in any reality on earth.

nacho
11/10/17 9:44 am

Spending other people's money is great when you are the spender.

Not so much when you are the source.

Corruption and deviation from the mission statement and mission creep is inherent in any welfare or public assistance program.

Why else have people qualify for programs when they are 150% or 200%, above the so called poverty level?

Spiritof76 USA 1776
11/07/17 7:25 pm

It had to be done to prevent another FDR.

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TrueAmerican7 I Am Galt.
11/07/17 7:16 pm

2 terms for POTUS
1 for Senator
5 for Representative.
This ensures (per the Founders rationale) constant opportunities to “refresh” the government, and ensures that no one person can remain in those positions of power longer than 10 years.

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otto Olean, NY
11/07/17 8:28 pm

Agree @True. But for Congress I would propose a 12-16 year limit. Could be spilt into 2 Senate terms or 6-8 House terms or combination thereof.

I also agree Founders intention was NOT for career politicians, but I don’t think 12-16 yrs total is out of hand. It does provide for some consistency, but it also avoids my big pet peeve of congressmen serving from age 25 until they die. There is no reason for the Bernie Sanders and John McCains of the world. 30,40,50 years is just counterproductive to the society.

hokiejac Decatur, GA
11/08/17 1:23 pm

And yet most of the founders were career politicians. From 1775 until 1809, Jefferson was pretty much continuously in Office. Washington had about a 5 year break from the end of the revolutionary war until constitutional convention. John Adams was also in Office continuously from 1774 until 1801 with short breaks. Madison was in Office continuously from 1789 thru 1817. And Monroe was in Office from 1783 thru 1825 but he had bigger breaks of 4 and 3 years. Tell me again how the Founders didn’t foresee career politicians (or “statesmen” as they called it)?

otto Olean, NY
11/08/17 7:40 pm

To clarify, I actually call for 2 separate limits. 12-16 years House and Senate combined. A separate 8 years as president. So if they were able to graduate from House and/or Senate to presidency then TOTAL years of service would be 20-24, which is pretty similar to the Founders’ careers. But if they don’t rise to presidency, then 12-16 limit.

Also, back then most legislators held real private sector jobs while in office because federal government at that time served only its legitimate purpose and wasn’t a full-time job of inventing ways to intrude in the citizens’ lives. Sessions were shorter and less frequent. Which is what was intended and, as such, it was service rather than career. That is why they never envisioned entrenchment to be a problem.

Crawdaddy11 MIMNAZMN
11/07/17 7:12 pm

I was until recently. Currently I kinda think a 1 year limit would be appropriate.

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SantaClaus1225
11/07/17 6:39 pm

We should not allow more than 2 terms for a president. With that said:

Trump is very very very lucky.

Because otherwise:

Obama would have kicked Trump’s ass last year and easily got a 3rd term.

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FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/08/17 6:10 am

How does it feel to be living in la la land

FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/08/17 6:15 am

Because Obama wasn't a corporatist like Hillary who started 5 new military interventions, supported the tpp, and he still really appealed too the white working class in the Midwest, right?

FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/08/17 6:15 am

Obama facilitated trumps rise

hokiejac Decatur, GA
11/08/17 1:24 pm

Only because you right wingers went by shit crazy with a black man in the WH. Make no mistake though... Obama would have won a 3rd term against trump

Henry123 Connecticut
11/08/17 3:13 pm

I don’t like either of them but Obama obviously would have won...

FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/08/17 4:27 pm

🙄 how would it have been any better for the democrats? Obama cast his stones, betrayed his base and angered the right. And no it's not because he was black. Race baiter

Henry123 Connecticut
11/08/17 6:28 pm

Obama is more liked than Hilary and was much better at campaigning. That’s how he would’ve won...

historyqueen
11/08/17 6:56 pm

Heaven forbid, don't even think about more presidential time for Obama and the thought of more time with Donald Trump is horrifying!! We need someone with a cool head you can think through a situation and not act like a 2 year old.

ladyniner81 I hate people
11/09/17 7:35 am

Obama had nothing to do with Trump getting elected. The idiots who had nothing but blind hate for Obama (and Hillary) voted for him, the Republicans who blindly vote Republican, Democrats who hate Hillary voted for him, and not to mention Hillary was a fucking horrible candidate who was only in it for herself.

Praetorianus Fair enough.
11/07/17 6:25 pm

As long as the office holder is reelected and capable (not hampered by senility), what was considered good in the last election may still be good today. It also brings stability.

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Grimmy13 Socialist Californirado
11/07/17 6:15 pm

Term limits for the house and senate should be law, I can't imagine why they won't pass such a law!? I'm amused how most enter their office as lowly public servants simply working for the people, but somehow their bank accounts mysteriously amass millions upon millions.

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nacho
11/08/17 7:47 am

The rags to riches story of Maxine Waters and the Clintons demonstrating the value of public service.

Sentinel Ya ie wa noh
11/07/17 6:00 pm

"Rotation Not Stagnation!"......

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johonmilla Monroe, nc
11/07/17 5:28 pm

I’m not really a fan of it. If people think a president is doing a good job, he should remain.

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Gunfighter06 Iowa, since 1846
11/07/17 4:46 pm

It codifies Washington's precedent, which is good. Too bad it took FDR the Tyrant to make it necessary.

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TrueAmerican7 I Am Galt.
11/07/17 7:07 pm

This 👆. Following.

Charlie1988 Massachusetts
11/07/17 4:33 pm

Term limits make no sense. As long as there are regular elections and the people still vote for another term then they should be able to keep going. That's the point of elections. If their constuents think they are doing a bad job or prefer someone else then they get voted out. Experience is a good thing in any other profession, and it should hold true for the government. I don't want all my representatives to be noobs.

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suppressedID Shut up man
11/07/17 4:30 pm

Term limits encourages a lazy electorate.

If you don’t like someone, vote them out of office. Or you get what you deserve.

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Gunfighter06 Iowa, since 1846
11/07/17 4:45 pm

Agree, but we *know* that the electorate is lazy, so we should take countermeasures such as term limits.

4Freedom1776
11/07/17 6:31 pm

So we deserve to lose our freedoms because the masses are lazy shitstains I don’t think so.

suppressedID Shut up man
11/08/17 6:12 am

Yes. Otherwise you have a tyranny by minority.

Gunfighter06 Iowa, since 1846
11/08/17 6:34 am

"lose our freedoms"

What do term limits have to do with our freedoms? Discouraging career politicians would be good for our freedoms if anything.

4Freedom1776
11/08/17 6:49 am

Easy gunfighter I’m agreeing with you. Suppressed said we deserve what we get if people don’t vote. Well I think there should be a check against this in the form of term limits.

4Freedom1776
11/08/17 9:11 am

Youre good I like your passion

DerekWills Lone Star Gun Rights
11/07/17 3:50 pm

Anyone who cites the founders for term limits doesn’t know history. Washington would have served a 3rd term had he been younger, and he said as much in a letter in 1799, shortly before his death. Term limits are stupid and don’t do a damn thing to solve the problems people think they do.

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ShowerTofu Kentucky
11/07/17 3:49 pm

I'm a fan of term limits but I personally think the limit should be three terms instead of two.

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lightsabr2 The Wild Blue Yonder
11/07/17 3:07 pm

Yep. Up next: Congressional term limits.

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sb129 Clayton, Ohio
11/07/17 3:29 pm

Because house has more people and they serve more years. Longest ever was 59 years.

PrussianJunker Rochester, NY
11/07/17 2:39 pm

Yes. Politics shouldn’t be a career. You are serving your nation.

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jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 3:31 pm

Politics should be a career. Otherwise the country would be run by incompetent, inexperienced fools who have no idea what they’re doing.

PrussianJunker Rochester, NY
11/07/17 3:44 pm

Elected officials shouldn’t be running jack shit. Their only job is to vote on what they think their district wants to happen at a national level. They don’t run anything.

jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 4:02 pm

I take it you don’t understand how government works.

suppressedID Shut up man
11/07/17 4:32 pm

I guess you don’t like career soldiers either. They are “just” serving their country.

rayd
11/07/17 5:41 pm

Sounds like where we are now!

jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 2:33 pm

No. The people should be able to elect a president as many times as they want.

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Henry123 Connecticut
11/07/17 2:55 pm

I fully agree with that when it comes to other elected representatives but the presidency specifically holds too much individual power and far too much chance of corruption because of that that it becomes a special case

jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 3:30 pm

That’s why there are checks and balances on the executive branch.

Henry123 Connecticut
11/07/17 4:58 pm

Yes and a term limit is one of them I’m glad we agree

jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 7:52 pm

A check that shouldn’t exist. If the people decide someone should serve five terms, then that’s a decision that should be left up to the people.

Robert97206 Portland Oregon
11/07/17 1:56 pm

If we are going to change an amendment, maybe we should abolish slavery for real.

Lol.

Wilsoc1 North Carolina
11/07/17 5:19 pm

Uh, did you just blow in from stupid town?

PrinceOberyn Io Himeros
11/07/17 1:52 pm

The executive should serve for life...and be crowned. God Save The King.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 1:42 pm

I would like to see the 22nd Amendment changed to include, not only all the Executive branch, but the entire Federal Legislative & Judicial branches, including the SCOTUS. “Clean house” & drain the entire political bureaucratic Federal swamp every eight years‼️

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FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/07/17 1:37 pm

No. There's no reason someone qualified for two terms can't serve a few more. Think about a three term Reagan, or someone else who was a real popular president. Then maybe also they could actually accomplish something in office

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FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/07/17 1:38 pm

It also perpetuates the two party system, our current politics and the status quo

jfish82285 Tennessean in Colorado
11/07/17 3:32 pm

I’m quite shocked to say I agree with you.

ladyniner81 I hate people
11/09/17 7:42 am

I think there should be term limits on the two parties because they're testing my patience

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/09/17 8:00 am

Lifetime Politicians & Bureaucrats need to become an extinct species, like the “goony birds” they are❗️The father of our Country George Washington suggested it & his American progeny should demand it‼️

jc1873 Nashville, TN
11/07/17 1:35 pm

Now… Limit congressman as well!

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CoffeeNow CandybarThiefLivesMatter
11/07/17 12:44 pm

Yes, especially for horrible presidents like FDR

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dylkohl The Media Lies
11/07/17 12:37 pm

congressmen should also have term limits

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moldypipes9
11/07/17 12:36 pm

It should b one term at 6 years. That way they dont spend 18 months of their first term re-campaigning

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Domino3 Abolish the ATF
11/07/17 12:12 pm

No, if we have a great president that the country generally loves I see no reason to limit his terms.

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timeout Boston Strong
11/07/17 12:09 pm

I’m a fan of both...he was right for his time but the amendment was necessary.

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Robert97206 Portland Oregon
11/07/17 11:58 am

Yes.
Politician should not be more than a temporary position.

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cowboy SCOTUS 2020
11/07/17 11:55 am

To keep pieces of shot like him to only two terms. One of the worst Presidents ever.

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Harry3603 Tampa Bay Florida.
11/07/17 11:53 am

Yes, without it, the racist idiots would have stuck us with Obama for four more years!

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Agonist Iowa
11/07/17 2:07 pm

Yes, or the racist idiots likely will stick us with tRump for a 3rd term!

sb129 Clayton, Ohio
11/07/17 11:52 am

Yes! A third term of obama would have turned the US in to a third world country!

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UniversePlan Michigan
11/07/17 12:15 pm

This user is currently being ignored

PyroSadist like my comments follow
11/07/17 12:50 pm

And he was well on his way to accomplishing that task

FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
11/07/17 1:39 pm

Reagan third term, potentially fourth term

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 1:51 pm

I loved Reagan & would probably have voted for him a 3rd term, & for that very reason, George Washington in his wisdom opposed & wouldn’t accept 3 or more terms, it would be too much like having a de facto King, like British rule that we rebelled against !

UniversePlan Michigan
11/07/17 5:13 pm

This user is currently being ignored

PyroSadist like my comments follow
11/07/17 5:26 pm

I was too young to vote for Reagan in 1980....but I damn sure voted for him in 1984 and would have again in 88 if I could have

UniversePlan Michigan
11/07/17 5:55 pm

This user is currently being ignored

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 6:14 pm

Uni, what else is are you drinking in that DemLib kool-aid❓8yrs of Obama were a disaster in all phases of our nation’s downward spiral😱

phalnx Ohio
11/07/17 6:48 pm

I hate to burst your bubble, shippy, but Washington declined a third term because he didn't want to die in office (and he would have), and he never felt comfortable with the role.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 8:02 pm

Pha, before you stick to your burst my “bubble” statement, ya might want to read the attached Writings of Washington before you perjure, or embarrass yourself😡

www.gilderlehrman.org

Washington on a proposed third term and political parties, 1799

phalnx Ohio
11/07/17 8:34 pm

When I get off work (in 9 hours), I'll look up that bio of him that I read and point you to it. It's one of those 600+ page academic-style dealies that uses direct quotes to back up its claims about the man. I think it paints a pretty complete picture of who he was, without all the fawning Founding Father worship most American History books indulge in.

Yes, he was without a doubt an anti-monarchist, as well as a very reluctant President. You have to look at all of his statements, as well as the context in which he made them, to get a true picture of his motivations. A lot of people make statements that are half-true. His health, IMO, was the primary reason he limited himself to 2 terms.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 9:35 pm

Pha, the site I sent you didn’t mention his heath as a mitigation factor, Just Washington’s written correspondence, & reasons he would not seek a third term.

phalnx Ohio
11/07/17 10:04 pm

That's my point. Other sources (including the writings of his contemporaries) mention that he had bouts of serious illness throughout his adult life...some so serious that he thought he might die. It was, in fact, one of these illnesses that did kill him in 1799. Writings to and from his various acquaintances are where this is mentioned, not in his official statements of policy.

I think you'll really enjoy that book. I wish I could remember who wrote it...soon.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/07/17 10:21 pm

Pha, The site I sent you focused more on Washington being disgusted & fed up with the political bickering & in fighting within the founders, like T. Jefferson, J. Adams, A. Hamilton, A. Burr, which I’m sure contributed to his deteriorating health, but I still maintain, he was primarily tired, of the whole nasty political mess, the government had become, just as I am now !

GoCougs Washington
11/09/17 2:08 am

Lol @shippy. Reagan would have been so far gone mentally during a potential third term it would have been absurd to have voted for him. He was losing it during his second term.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/09/17 5:03 am

Yes, I agree about no third term for Reagan as well as all others, FDR was an example of why no one should serve terms beyond two, the job & stress that goes with being POTUS finally killed him !

phalnx Ohio
11/09/17 7:01 am

Sorry about that...I completely forgot about the book. It's 'The Real George Washington' by the National Center for Constitutional Studies. It's got an ass-ton of focused excerpts of letters he wrote. Highly recommended.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/09/17 8:04 am

Thanks Pha, I’ll read it, have you ever read the Federalist Papers❓They too are an interesting read.

phalnx Ohio
11/09/17 6:21 pm

I have indeed. All that stuff is free on Kindle, and doesn't take too long to read. If you really want to get to the root of our Constitution, though, Aristotle's Constitution of Athens is the template from which Jefferson and Madison copied.

I also liked Thomas Paine's war pamphlets a lot...Washington considered him more important for the war effort than he himself was.

There's tons of interesting stuff out there...sorry the book I recommended isn't free, but it does a great enough job at condensing all the source material to be worth it.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
11/09/17 6:31 pm

Pha, I’ll “look” into it👀 thx