Show of HandsShow of Hands

polster2 November 5th, 2017 9:02pm

Do you think that the churchgoers shot to death in Texas today should have been carrying guns to defend themselves while praying and singing hymns?

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gunluvr NOT a Gun Free Zone
11/06/17 8:38 am

10 years ago, someone came in and shot up the sanctuary at our congregation here in Texas... I conceal carry at all services ..,

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gunluvr NOT a Gun Free Zone
11/06/17 8:44 am

Typo , it was 20 years ago

Think Lovin Life
11/06/17 6:31 am

So, it appears that @MrsCrayonWax has once again cowardly blocked me.

This discussion contains several interactions between us where I spoke the truth and she/he/it couldn’t abide that truth. Given MrsCW’s history of back biting, I suspect that they’ve made addition comments here after blocking me.

Beware of cowardly users like MrsCW.

kspells TheOtherOtherside
11/06/17 3:27 am

Jesus doesn’t carry. He would have Archangels slaughter for him.

Think Lovin Life
11/06/17 6:17 am

Suppressed ... shall we ask the money changers in the temple?

suppressedID Science is right
11/05/17 10:53 pm

So they should have been wearing Kevlar.

kspells TheOtherOtherside
11/06/17 3:19 am

There is only one state with a higher % of its citizens carrying a gun at all times than Texas. So if ‘they’ were not armed; then what difference would it make to speculate what might have been if the had been. Guns are not the problem. Just like more guns are not the solution.

suppressedID Science is right
11/06/17 7:06 am

So making Kevlar mandatory makes sense. You’re always ready.

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 3:48 pm

Polster ... since you decided to venture into picking apart grammar, your poll question is ridiculous! How can people sing and pray after they’ve been shot to death?

Of course, citizens should be allowed to carry a gun to defend themselves.

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polster2 US
11/05/17 3:49 pm

Wow, you're really upset over my pointing out that your grammar and spelling is poor, huh?

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 3:56 pm

Polster ... wrong yet again. I suggested that you reconsider picking on grammar and you refused to back down. You show yet again that you can dish it, but you can’t take it.

polster2 US
11/05/17 4:04 pm

How am I “not taking it?”

MachoMatt84 Mountain climbing
11/05/17 3:47 pm

Yeah, of course. I carry at my church.

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polster2 US
11/05/17 3:48 pm

And I bet you chew tobacco in the pews, too.

MachoMatt84 Mountain climbing
11/05/17 10:15 pm

No, I don't use tobacco. I care about the people around me. I don't expect anything bad to happen, but I'm ready if something does happen. You're no safer at a church than you are anywhere else. In fact, lately, churches have started to become more of a target lately, it would appear. I can't think of any good reason *not* to carry.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 3:04 pm

We don’t know that some weren’t. Also, in a mass shooting, how many more innocent people would be killed as 40 people whip out a gun and shoot in self defense?

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polster2 US
11/05/17 3:10 pm

It’s ridiculous to carry a gun to church.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 3:25 pm

I don’t think it would have helped is all I’m saying and people shouldn’t have to go to church armed.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:26 pm

I agree.

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 4:00 pm

Polster & MrsCW ... neither of you can know that a gun carrying parishioner wouldn’t have helped in this case. A parishioner in the last congregation that was carrying a gun certainly prevented more death in that case.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 4:01 pm

Think I don’t disagree. I don’t think a church full of parishioners all firing on one another is a wise thing.

polster2 US
11/05/17 4:04 pm

I wish we could live in a country where the NRA didn’t pay our politicians to delay necessary action to keep us safer.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 4:08 pm

I’m not anti 2a or anti gun ownership so we part ways there, pol. However, I think that knee jerk reactions aren’t helpful when we don’t even have all the info. In Vegas, they had a hard time gathering intel because multiple people had guns out in self defense after Paddock began firing. It slowed down the process and made for a potentially dangerous situation.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 5:00 pm

And it has just been reported that a citizen returned fire. It is not known if it was a church goer or a bystander but he chased the shooter until he met his death. It is unsure if he shot himself or if the citizen shot him.

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 8:34 pm

Polster & MrsCW ... so once again we learn that the knee jerk of leftists is leads to conclusions that are totally wrong.

We are now learning that the murderer was tracked down by a concerned citizen with a gun. While it’s not clear if the citizen killed the murderer or whether the coward killed himself, what we do know is that it was not the police or even the police pursuit that ended the rampage. We know that it was a good guy with a gun that interfered with a madman’s carnage.

It must sting, even for hardened leftists, to be this wrong this often. Have a swell evening.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/05/17 8:40 pm

I’m not a leftist. But I see your back to your prick ways.

polster2 US
11/05/17 8:46 pm

And yet this never would have happened if the NRA didn’t buy our politicians off.

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 9:01 pm

MrsCW ... the truth doesn’t care about your feelings or your silly predictions. You were wrong about this case, as is par for your course!

Think Lovin Life
11/05/17 9:03 pm

Polster ... there you go again making silly statements that you can’t defend. Are you suggesting that the only reason we have the right to bear arms is because of the NRA?

polster2 US
11/06/17 3:15 am

No, I’m suggesting that this massacre would not have happened if the NRA didn’t pay our politicians to oppose gun control measures, which would prevent crazy people from purchasing guns.

kscott516 Show Time
11/06/17 6:27 am

Which gun control measure would've stopped it?

polster2 US
11/06/17 6:28 am

Making it illegal to sell guns to mentally ill people.

kscott516 Show Time
11/06/17 7:00 am

You think someone with a mental illness can't get a gun?

polster2 US
11/06/17 7:01 am

I think we should make it as difficult as possible.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/06/17 7:21 am

If I’m not mistaken, this guy had a dishonorable discharge so he should have never been able to obtain them. So did he have them illegally? If so, mental health checks wouldn’t have helped.

polster2 US
11/06/17 7:22 am

He was not dishonorably discharged. The New York Times lied about that and were forced to issue a correction.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/06/17 7:34 am

If he had a felony conviction, he is not allowed to own a firearm. Was his courmartial for abuse a felony conviction? If so, he was unable to legally own guns.

kscott516 Show Time
11/06/17 7:42 am

Polster, the point always gets back to the very real fact that even felons can get guns. No amount of gun control can stop that.

MrsCrayonWax Katies Purpose
11/06/17 7:43 am

While it pains me, I agree, Scotty.

kscott516 Show Time
11/06/17 8:40 am

The truth can be painful sometimes

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 2:52 pm

Yes. Why not? There’s nothing incompatible with carrying a gun and going to church.

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polster2 US
11/05/17 2:54 pm

Yeah, a minister whipping out a pistol is totally not weird at all...

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:12 pm

It’s not lol

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:14 pm

Experienced gun owners don’t brandish their sidearms. Take a gun safety course.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:15 pm

You seriously believe that it isn’t weird to go to church armed?

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:16 pm

Is it weird to carry pepper spray to church? That’s a weapon too.

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:17 pm

Nope. It’s totally fine.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:17 pm

Pepper spray doesn’t kill people.

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:18 pm

It’s a still a weapon pollster.

What about pocket knives?

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:19 pm

Terrorists kill people with cars, too. Should we stop driving to church, too?

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:20 pm

Most terrorists and mass shooters are males.
Maybe men should stop going to church. It’s just too weird.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:22 pm

If you can identify a legitimate reason, besides self-defense, to carry a gun into a church service, I’ll give you a cookie.

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:22 pm

Dylan roof was white and shot up a church.

Stop going to church Milk, it’s too weird.

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:23 pm

The second amendment does not require me to provide a reason to carry a weapon.

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:23 pm

Self defense is pretty much the only reason to carry a weapon, or drive. Ever heard of defensive driving?

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:27 pm

People drive to get from point A to point B. They don’t drive defensively for the sake of driving defensively.

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 3:28 pm

Now you’re telling people why to drive? 🤦‍♂️

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:28 pm

But you gotta defend yourself from the other drivers while getting there. You gotta defend yourself while you drive, hence defensive driving.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:31 pm

I agree, but the primary reason why people drive is to get from point A to point B. Defensive driving is just one way to accomplish that goal.

MrEdwin Mystery
11/05/17 3:33 pm

Exactly, you have to drive defensible or else the other cars driving offensively are gonna wreck you because you didn’t drive defensively and then the driver is going to be stressed because he probably can’t afford a new car.

polster2 US
11/05/17 3:41 pm

But again, the primary reason why people drive is to get where they're going.

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 4:52 pm

And the primary reason people carry guns is to protect themselves. This event should demonstrate that nowhere is safe, and so nowhere should be gun free.

4boot LaTrineodeur, MN
11/05/17 5:29 pm

Carrying a gun in church for self-defense is not as weird as being slaughtered by a nut or terrorist without having the means to stop it.

polster2 US
11/05/17 5:44 pm

That’s why there should be a law that nuts cannot have access to guns, but the NRA won’t allow that.

MrMilkdud Pref pronouns Thou Thee
11/05/17 5:45 pm

Tell me how to enforce that, or how to predict future insanity.

polster2 US
11/05/17 5:47 pm

I don’t know the answers to those questions. I think gun buyback programs nationwide would do a lot of good, though.

4boot LaTrineodeur, MN
11/05/17 6:48 pm

Gun buy backs? There are an estimated 500 million guns in the US. Unrealistic, whether voluntary or mandatory. Voluntary won't make a dent. Mandatory would likely spark massive disobedience or civil war.

polster2 US
11/05/17 6:50 pm

First of all, the number of guns already out there is closer to 300 million. Second, voluntary buybacks have been at least somewhat successful in the past, so it’s reasonable to believe that they will be at least somewhat successful in the future.

think4yourself Not a safe space
11/05/17 6:58 pm

There are some old laws where you had to carry a gun to church because Indians would trap people in and burn the church down with them in it.

4boot LaTrineodeur, MN
11/05/17 6:59 pm

I just heard on the news two former government officials, one a retired ATF agent (obviously an expert), say there are an estimated 500 million firearms in the US. The ATF person also said further gun legislation is pointless considering the number of firearms "out there". Under a voluntary buyback program, only those unlikely to commit crimes would participate. Mandatory...not going to happen in the US unless we fall into tyranny. If a tyranny, we would have far more problems than we have now...

think4yourself Not a safe space
11/05/17 7:06 pm

Just a quick search referenced an old Massachusetts law, “All men must carry a rifle to church on Sunday.” www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/massachusetts

polster2 US
11/05/17 7:16 pm

How do you know that only those unlikely to commit crimes would participate?

4boot LaTrineodeur, MN
11/05/17 7:17 pm

Because I have common sense.

polster2 US
11/05/17 7:17 pm

I don’t believe in common sense. I believe in data. Come back when you have some of that.

Think Lovin Life
11/06/17 6:20 am

Polster ... that’s the most honest thing you’ve ever said ... you “don’t believe in common sense”! That’s SO true!!! One of your fatal flaws is that you have no common sense!

polster2 US
11/06/17 6:22 am

Having common sense doesn’t matter. If your “common sense” isn’t backed up by evidence and data, then it’s completely irrelevant.