Show of HandsShow of Hands

political November 5th, 2017 7:25pm

Christians: “Though man is fallen, he is not incapacitated by the sinful nature and can freely choose God. His will is not restricted and enslaved by his sinful nature.”

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GlockMan1 Alabama
11/05/17 2:14 pm

As a Calvinist, we believe GOD CHOOSES US. We believe all men and women are born with a sin nature that rejects God and only through the miraculous work of the Holy Spirit are we DRAWN to God. For by GRACE are we saved.

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political Georgia
11/05/17 2:22 pm

Should we use Romans 6:20 or John 8:34 to refute this claim?

Okie1967 Defend the Police
11/05/17 1:12 pm

Very true so long as addiction is not in the picture. Addiction limits free will. Free will is exercised in the initial stages of addiction, but is lost after the addiction takes hold. This is why we should avoid addictive substances - our ability to live a Christian life goes away when addiction sets in.

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bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 12:30 pm

We can freely choose God. Not sure your purpose in this one.

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political Georgia
11/05/17 12:31 pm

Well, I would disagree with your comment because I don’t believe someone who is dead in trespasses and sins (Ephesians 2:1) is able to choose life.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 12:39 pm

??? Obviously we aren't on the same wave length here. Do you choose to love God, live a God centered life, etc.

political Georgia
11/05/17 12:44 pm

If you are not regenerated by the Holy Spirit, no.

If you are regenerated, you love God because He gives you a new heart. You choose to live a Christ-centered life because of your new heart.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 12:58 pm

I don't know what you mean by regenerated.

political Georgia
11/05/17 1:01 pm

Born again

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 1:21 pm

Ahh, we've had that discussion before. We disagree on that concept as well.

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:03 pm

You don’t believe someone must be born again?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 2:05 pm

We had that discussion somewhat recently. To me if you are in the church your whole life, there's no born again awakening, it's just apart of who you are. Others who are born again find Jesus later in life.

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:07 pm

John 3:3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

You can go to Church your whole life without being born again. Church attendance doesn’t save you.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 2:10 pm

Do you seriously not recall this exact conversation. And no its not about church attendance, it's about always being a believer.

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:19 pm

Yeah - Is there any scriptural evidence of someone besides Jesus believing in God from the very start?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 2:45 pm

Some interpretation on your part is needed here. Shouldn't have to spell it all out.
When you go from the beginning, believing in God is all you know. Doesn't mean you believed from birth, babies don't know the difference. By the time you are old enough to know, God is what you know. No need to be "born again". Believing and having faith just is apart of your life and who you are.

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:53 pm

I assume that you have some verses to back this up?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 2:55 pm

I'm simply stating facts for how many people grow up in the church.
I'm not sure what your issue is.

political Georgia
11/05/17 3:06 pm

Let’s try this, what do you think it means to be born again?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/05/17 3:12 pm

Someone who has lived their life as a non believer and at some point comes to "find the Lord". That's not how it works for people who grow up in the church.
And yes, i believe that means we view that phrase differently. Which is what caused this conversation before

political Georgia
11/06/17 6:42 am

Isn’t everyone an unbeliever at some point?

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/06/17 7:18 am

There is a difference between being so young that you don't know either way and being older and choosing not to believe.

political Georgia
11/06/17 7:24 am

Scripture claims that we were all dead in trespasses and sins. In order to maintain your position, you have to deny original sin that was passed down from Adam and Eve.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/06/17 7:29 am

Now you are discussing sonething different.

political Georgia
11/06/17 7:31 am

No - I’m showing the necessity and reasoning for being born again.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/06/17 7:34 am

I thought we established that we define being born again differently.

political Georgia
11/06/17 7:53 am

Not really - born again is when the Holy Spirit gives you a new heart. As a result, you change from your original dead sinful state.

bluerum29 optimistic idealist
11/06/17 10:41 am

And I believe that those who are raised in the church, that heart develops as you grow in your faith and are learning about the lord. So by the time you are old enough to understand and recognize the meaning, the only heart you have understood in yourself is one for God.

political Georgia
11/05/17 12:27 pm

I predict 82% agreement on this poll. I will stand firmly as a dissenter to this assertion.

MrAmerica Neo Aristotelian
11/05/17 2:01 pm

I’m thinking that t will be somewhere around 90-95%

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:05 pm

You had an advantage of looking at the current results!

Glockman and Calvinist will bring the percentage down, and I was thinking that a few Southern Baptists might lean toward the disagreeing side.

MrAmerica Neo Aristotelian
11/05/17 2:10 pm

Lol, yeah, I kind of “cheated” in the regard that I can see the latest results right now when making my prediction.

I am actually very surprised by the results of this poll.

political Georgia
11/05/17 2:20 pm

I just quoted the first point of Arminianism when posting this poll.