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TheOhioMarxist May 31st, 2017 1:37am

Do you have a positive or negative view of communism?

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robopolis NC
05/30/17 10:13 pm

There's always that small percentage that believe the moon landing was faked or that communism works

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LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 10:30 pm

Sadly only a few know that the Zapatista Community, Rojava, the Free Territory of Ukraine, and Revolutionary Catalonia exist.

robopolis NC
05/31/17 5:49 am

Hahahahaha okay sure. With no advances in technology, minimal societal advancement, and the only one that lasted/seems stable is the Mexican one, I'm sure you can label these as a success. A starving success maybe?

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/31/17 7:46 am

Nope, Rojava still exists, also living standards, production, and literacy rates improved in Revolutionary Catalonia, industrialization rapidly increased, despite the fact that Spain was largely agricultural.

robopolis NC
05/31/17 12:29 pm

If you read closely, I implied that rojava wasn't stable.(it isn't)
Also, so what? Commie Spain had to industrialize to compete against the fascists. USSR did the same thing. If these are the best you can come up with, I'm glad communism is a debunked, ridiculed ideology. Better luck next time but keep hope in those unwashed peasants in the Mexican jungle

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/31/17 12:51 pm

The fundamental problem with saying x doesn't work is that since sufficient conditions for working are not set so one can move the goalposts as they please, regardless of how massive they are, that they've lasted for decades, that they tend to fall only due to outside intervention, or the improvements in living conditions compared to their previous socioeconomic structure, that can all be brushed to the side simply by moving the goalpost, eventually going out of the stadium.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/31/17 1:04 pm

Also I think I should clarify, I don't think these absolute faith should be placed in these communes, they show that an alternative socioeconomic structure is very possible, and that a lot can be learned from their mistakes and accomplishments, but the end goal is not to establish these and maintain them, but rather introduce these methods of organization to everyday life.

krazyjoe Chicago
05/30/17 8:49 pm

For the 15%, just leave the country. I don't want you unpatriotic bastards here. The reason we are allowed to trade with say...Japan is free market and military strength. The reasone we have not been invaded is because of what the founders created which idiots continue to destroy. Our system created the world economy, and created more peace in our nation than any nation before. If you combined every other nation's market it still would not match ours. Stop complaining about our system and start studying why it has been so successful.

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Wert A picture of my junk
05/30/17 8:03 pm

Depends if you are talking about actual communism or communism as it been deployed in the real world.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 6:53 pm

The positive outweighs the negative, I'm definitely positive about anarcho communism, council communism, situationism, Luxembourgism, autonomism, and for the most part Classical Marxism.

doober72 Vidalia, Ga.
05/30/17 7:09 pm

You should visit north Korea.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 7:18 pm

That would be a very interesting trip, I might be down for that. I mean I hate the country and its government but that hasn't stopped me from living where I do. Also I hope you're aware that North Korea has removed all references to communism from their constitution, and that their leading ideology has been Juche for decades.

doober72 Vidalia, Ga.
05/30/17 7:20 pm

Buy an open ended ticket.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 7:26 pm

It's a bit odd why you're so enthusiastic about it, I just endorsed an anarchist school of thought, so I don't know why your recommendation was to a totalitarian state.

doober72 Vidalia, Ga.
05/30/17 7:30 pm

Dude, your crazy. Don't go to Communist Korea. You probably won't come back. Please, change your mind.

TheOhioMarxist Ohio
05/30/17 8:06 pm

I fucking am. Its on my bucket list. And it ain't communist.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 8:14 pm

There isn't a communist Korea, there's a capitalist Korea and a totalitarian Korea with Juche as its official ideology. The fact you can make so many mistakes and get upvoted speaks volumes to how embarrassingly little the majority of this app knows about communism.

krazyjoe Chicago
05/30/17 8:51 pm

Are you high? Regardless of labels China and North Korea are still communist countries. I also love how liberals will defend these shitholes that have horrendous human rights records.

TheOhioMarxist Ohio
05/30/17 8:55 pm

Did you just call me a fucking liberal? How fucking dense are you? Liberals arent communist. Liberalism and communism are two very different thing. Honestly, I hate liberals more than pricks like you. And I've never once seen a liberal defend the DPRK. Where the fuck did you get that? And no, the DPRK isnt communist, at all. Fuck out of here with that reactionary bullshit.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
05/30/17 10:28 pm

Literally everything about krazy's comment was wrong, none of us are liberals, North Korea has completely severed itself from the communist movement, China is unrecognizable from the Maoist era, and no one was defending North Korea, I literally said I hate the country and its government.

TheOhioMarxist Ohio
05/30/17 10:29 pm

Im aware. It was autistic. What set me off is him calling me a damn liberal.

ComradeJames nationalism
06/01/17 6:17 am

"I support these libertarian forms of communism."

"Really? Prove it by going to this authoritarian country. Otherwise, you don't really support what you say you support."

👍

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
06/01/17 2:15 pm

I'm not gonna pretend the DPRK is a wonderful place, because it probably isn't. (But who knows, because the only information we really have about it is from bourgeois propaganda.) But their public reason for removing statements about communism from their constitution (although not socialism) was because it's impossible to have a stateless society while imperialist powers continue to exist, who desire the nation's destruction. It's impossible to fully develop Marxist theory to that extent, because of the imperialist powers.

LeftLibertarian The Age of Outrage
06/01/17 2:51 pm

The odd thing about that is that the existence of imperial powers didn't stop Marxist-Leninist states from referencing communism, it seems like yet another clear difference between North Korea and them, as well as their focus on family linage and to some extent ethnic nationalism rather than class struggle and analysis of material conditions (not saying the last two were nonexistent in North Korea, just a lower priority). I guess I'd say I don't see that as a valid reason for North Korea to do so and I wouldn't be surprised if other reasons had more of a sway on that decision.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
06/01/17 6:27 pm

Well I think it's more about the role of the state. It no longer has the goal of the withering away of the state because the state can't wither away, because of imperialist powers.

krazyjoe Chicago
06/01/17 8:23 pm

And where is the communist utopian you dream of?

krazyjoe Chicago
06/01/17 8:26 pm

Capitalism from America has allowed most of us to live better than any other nation. In fact, other nations has prospered due to our government....which people like you, and liberals want to change

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
06/01/17 8:30 pm

The communist utopia is the theoretical consequence of socialism. I call it theoretical because no Marxist society has reached that point.

The reason the American proletariat is privileged compared to the proletariat in the third world is the consequence of two primary factors. The first is the violent labor movement that existed until around the time of FDR, when he quelled it by giving the proletariat a few token items. The second is the use of imperialism to artificially inflate the standard of living in western nations through the exploitation and importation of foreign goods.

TheOhioMarxist Ohio
06/01/17 8:31 pm

If you want, I can throw together a list of nations with less poverty, lower rates of infant mortality, higher literacy rates, less hunger, etc. The people of this nation can be living much better lives elsewhere.