Show of HandsShow of Hands

RJ1969 July 13th, 2013 4:21pm

Would you join a Christian institution that would take your 10% tithe and apply it to the costs incurred that include the $10K -$20K per birth and cost of living expenses to support mothers and children that would otherwise terminate the pregnancy?

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Comments: Add Comment

Nukimo NC Dreaming of Far Away
07/15/13 6:25 am

You lost me @ "join" & "Christian institution."

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ZestOfClementine Ye Olde 802
07/13/13 6:24 pm

Would you join a christian institution...

No

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Rosebud Ohio
07/13/13 5:53 pm

Absolutely! Women need support in these situations. Been there, done that. Even just some clothes or diapers is so incredibly helpful.

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Rosebud Ohio
07/13/13 6:12 pm

I'll add, a big part of why I'm going into the line of work I am is so that I can give free or reduced care to women and girls who cannot afford it. I'm lucky though, my husband agrees it's more important to help others than to have fancy things. We don't desire more than a modest living anyways.

suppressedID That is my secret Cap
07/13/13 4:53 pm

When you start making other people's decisions for them, you take over the responsibility.

And by these numbers, you're FAILING the test, o' sanctimonious ones.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
07/13/13 4:28 pm

Giving the ladies money wouldn't make them want the baby any more in most cases.

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Skarface Banned
07/13/13 4:19 pm

You lost me at "Christian."

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curly
07/13/13 4:02 pm

Not the full 10%, no. You gotta keep the Sanctuary lights on after all. But I would most definitely support such a program.

Doopy Remedial Americanism
07/13/13 3:59 pm

Already have. My church supports a lot of crisis pregnancy ministries.

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Rosebud Ohio
07/13/13 5:55 pm

So does mine. Didn't realize it until I talked to some of the elders about starting something. They've been doing it, they just don't brag about it. Which I love. Do it to help people, not for your reputation.

comppete Las Vegas
07/13/13 2:02 pm

I would not join any religious institution, and I definitely would not tithe.

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beanD California
07/13/13 3:31 pm

Would you donate money to a cause?

comppete Las Vegas
07/13/13 3:38 pm

I do, but only to those causes where MOST of he money goes to where it is needed. I don't donate to charities or causes that pay salaries to those running it.

smacc DunningKruger
07/13/13 1:02 pm

If I weren't pro choice and I was going to be a member of a church it would be the right thing to do.

TopsQueen Oregon Coast
07/13/13 12:17 pm

Good idea. Plus job training.

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cyanospool The Deep North
07/13/13 11:23 am

I like the idea, but I wouldn't personally support it. People should be 100% financially independent at the time they have a child.

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huskermedic Cincinnati
07/13/13 11:43 am

This. I would give money to them but I would not want to support girls that did not take the proper prevention methods to prevent pregnancy.

beanD California
07/13/13 12:12 pm

Even if the alternative is a dead child?

cyanospool The Deep North
07/13/13 12:30 pm

I should say that I wouldn't support a service enabling financially unstable women to be irresponsible and get pregnant in the first place just because it's easy enough to get money from the church.

beanD California
07/13/13 1:29 pm

Generally, I don't think that would increase or decrease the amount of unprepared pregnant girls in the country, given that it's still a heck of a lot more convenient not to be pregnant in the first place.

beanD California
07/13/13 1:30 pm

If abortions are used for cases in which contraception did not work, there being support money won't increase the amount of times the condom breaks.

cyanospool The Deep North
07/13/13 9:41 pm

Yeah, but I'm not really willing to contribute 10% of my salary to make a bet on that. I'd rather wait and see if it makes a difference and contribute later. In the mean time, if someone I personally know is in a situation like this, I'd help.

thatguy81 here
07/13/13 11:00 am

"Join a Christian..."

No

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zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 11:14 am

Aw come on, it couldn't be that bad could it?

camlop San Diego, CA
07/14/13 6:37 pm

@livefree: I was just about to write that SAME EXACT comment!

Diogenes FreeMeBe
07/13/13 10:39 am

I don't believe in organized religion. That would qualify in my book.

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chinito Florida
07/13/13 10:29 am

Basically your question is: Would you donate 10% of your income to support unwanted children?

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chinito Florida
07/13/13 10:29 am

My answer is No.

The reason is because there are a lot of causes that can benefit from that money. Although I agree that this one is very important and noble I choose to donate my money elsewhere.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
07/13/13 10:27 am

No, because I wouldn't join a Christian institution and don't support the concept of tithing. I do support paying the medical expenses for either the pregnancy and birth or an abortion as part of my support for single-payer universal healthcare.

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palindrome California
07/13/13 10:47 am

Excellent answer. I agree 100%

palindrome California
07/13/13 9:49 am

No because churches say they use money for one thing and then use them for another. Who knows how much would actually end up in the hands of needy mothers. They'd probably use most of it on anti-abortion propaganda then actually helping

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EagleOK Oklahoma
07/13/13 9:53 am

Don't generalize every church. My church uses its funds very well.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:45 am

Christians do have an obligation to help children that are unwanted. I think that may be the point RJ is making.

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RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:49 am

I would submit PEOPLE should support children.

Obviously, my definition of children is different than some of yours.

ClarityRose Now taking suggestions
07/13/13 9:49 am

That is how I took it. Though I would argue that all of society, religious or not, have an obligation to help children. We should be helping each other more in general.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:49 am

My church operates an adoption agency as do the Catholics. We also have extensive welfare activities though none are directed at this specific issue. Basically, gov welfare fills this welfare space. You find private charities trying to compete there.

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:50 am

Good convo today Okie. You are a credit to your perspective.

I'm off to the beach. I will check in later. So, I'm leaving you in charge. Take care of this group.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:51 am

I agree with both of you, but Christians have a religious obligation too.

MrMilkdud
07/13/13 10:27 am

The Catholic Church already has a number of outreach programs for families in need. Everything from incidental needs, housing, childcare needs, volunteer physicians for healthcare, catholic hospitals basically give care for free to
those in need.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 10:37 am

That's cool Dud. I'm not trying to "one -up" you - we also have our own airplanes that we use to transport food into Africa with.

Churches do a lot of good.

MrMilkdud
07/13/13 10:47 am

Oh yeah? Well...we have our own city that's also a country. And tons of art. And lots of nuns who wear pantsuits instead of habits now.

MrMilkdud
07/13/13 10:48 am

Oh yeah? Well...we have our own city that's also a country. And tons of art. And lots of nuns who wear pantsuits instead of habits now.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 10:53 am

We have our own state -Utah. Your country is smaller than Salt Lake City.

zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 10:58 am

Lmao I was cracking up reading those comments Okie and Milkdud

MrMilkdud
07/13/13 11:08 am

I wasn't trying to one-up you okie (but we can drink alcohol)- I was just backing up
your point that work is already being done by a lot of churches. As for RJ's question, I wouldn't convert over social outreach, I am what I am because of theology.

MrMilkdud
07/13/13 11:10 am

If the faith and doctrine are correct, the charity follows.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 11:14 am

I agree Dud, and I wasn't trying to out-do you either (we can eat meat on Fridays).

:-)

jimiscott Survivor
07/13/13 12:47 pm

We can eat meat on Fridays, except during lent.

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 2:18 pm

I can eat meat 24/7.....

Including BACON. (Hmmm, my Jewish and Muslim friends!)

With a cold coke or beer (Mormon family)

Check mutha freakin mate!

christine1986
07/13/13 9:44 am

I wouldn't because I'm not Christian. But it is a wonderful idea and I would definitely join a secular version.

christine1986
07/13/13 9:47 am

I think you have gotten to the root of the problem. Too much judgement not enough helping and preventing. And private is the key word. Government can stay out.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:38 am

An analogy of your logic would be that persons who oppose gun ownership must financially support the families who are victims of gun violence, to the tune of 10% of your earnings, after tax.

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zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 9:41 am

What do you mean "must"? He is just asking if you would or not. Nobody is forcing anybody

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:42 am

There's too much of a disconnect there, equating gun ownership with the responsibilities of parenting. Your example could easily be reversed so that if you support gun ownership you must support the victims of gun violence.

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:43 am

Wait! 10% AFTER tax? Since when?

It's BEFORE tax. Just ask H&R Block.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:46 am

Oh that's right RJ. I forgot about the tax deduction. The contribution is from taxed dollars, but then there's the deduction on the back end.

I stand corrected. :-)

inge MIA
07/13/13 9:37 am

I absolutely would...but I'm not a Christian.

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zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 9:34 am

I like the idea, but I am not joining a "Christian institution"! Lol

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RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:35 am

OK, any organization. Being a religious one would, at least, grant it tax-exempt status.

EarlyBird Portland
07/13/13 9:39 am

RJ - Would you? What kind of organization?

zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 9:42 am

We definitely need more funding in this area

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:46 am

I think I prefer the continued use of tax monies to support parents in poverty and HC for children.

Otherwise, we'll continue to pay taxes and that will be used for the same crap they've been using it for instead of what they should be using it for.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:33 am

I'm opposed to murder too, but my opposition doesn't compel me morally to support murder victims or pay for programs to treat would-be murderers.

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RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:37 am

Hmmm, well said.

But you do support programs to identify, catch, and prevent murders, correct?

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:31 am

No. My opposition to abortion does not require that I support mothers and children.

I would be willing to make Increased donations to help the birthing and adoption process and move those children to adoptive families.

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RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:33 am

Then, respectfully, why should your opinion on this issue matter at all?

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:34 am

Sorry, my question relates to the first part of your post. The second part addresses my question.

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/13/13 9:35 am

You're operating on a logical fallacy. A person's advocacy of a particular public policy doesn't place an obligation on them to privately fund a program to solve the problem without public policy.

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:39 am

I like your reasoning here, Okie. Solid.

I would submit, however, that entering an issue that is 'public' in nature means you are participating in it, hence the term public. If you do not, then, by definition, it remains private.

Good exchanges Okie.

beanD California
07/13/13 9:40 am

It sort of does. I mean, there's no OBLIGATION as such, but you look pretty wimpy if all you do is complain and argue and you never actually go out an help your own cause.

satiricalnick meh
07/13/13 9:24 am

Theres another a word you democrats should learn.

ADOPTION.

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RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:28 am

That doesn't address the question. $20K per birth. Plus healthcare and expenses until a family willing to adopt can be found.

Would you be willing to donate 8 hours per week to work at an adoption service to help facilitate an adoption program?

zman117 Ohio
07/13/13 9:31 am

That's their problem! Murica!

RJ1969 SoCal
07/13/13 9:22 am

Grammar alert! 'of' children.

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ClarityRose Now taking suggestions
07/13/13 9:50 am

Great question rj! I like the creative problem solving :)