Show of HandsShow of Hands

Show Of Hands December 17th, 2016 10:20pm

Should elementary schools teach a second language as part of early education curriculum?

51 Liked

Comments: Add Comment

lonelyweeb608 Tennessee
12/28/16 12:11 am

Even if they don't remember half the language later on, the effort to learn it is a good workout for the brain.

HHCarlson Maryland
12/20/16 11:29 am

It would be good as long as the kids are taught a good language and not a disgusting one like French, Spanish, Chinese, Arabic, or Hindi

skacey best poll is evenly split
12/19/16 12:15 am

I took Spanish in 5th grade. I was bored and distracted so the teacher moved me to reading. When I left, I will never forget what she told me. She said that if I didn't apply myself I would end up being a ditch digger.

I though about that when I was in basic training digging foxholes.

Reply
613dimples New York
12/18/16 10:57 pm

I learned another language in elementary school and now I speak it fluently. Kids pick up languages quicker than adults. What a great opportunity to learn something useful.

Reply
Survivalistien I am Green and Retired
12/18/16 8:21 pm

If youre in america learn english because of the majority. If in Iraq speak Farsii, china, russia so on you get it, dont be a multiculturalist pig. Only assimulate to the culture of the country you live in.

Yessy French Texan
12/18/16 9:33 pm

Um I live in America but I speak 5 languages if you include English! English isn't the only important language! For all we know , Chinese could become more more important than English in 50 years!

Yessy French Texan
12/18/16 9:39 pm

Just chill! I'm Hispanic mix French! I think it would be a great idea! I know many are blaming all Hispanics because just a few of them are refusing to learn English! I do think it's important for them to adapt but I also think it's important for elementary children to learn a secondary language and it doesn't have to be Spanish! You teach them Japanese,Italian,German!

Survivalistien I am Green and Retired
12/18/16 9:41 pm

Im Scottish and only Scottish, speak Scots gael, english and some german only because of work.

AmyElizabeth Outside of Philly
12/18/16 4:23 pm

Fuck Spanish, people need to learn English in America.

Reply
Yessy French Texan
12/18/16 9:37 pm

I speak Spanish,French,Italian,Català,and English (In order of fluency and native languages)! Do you want your kids to have better job opportunities , then it might be helpful to teach them a secondary language!

Yessy French Texan
12/18/16 9:39 pm

Just chill! I'm Hispanic mix French! I think it would be a great idea! I know many are blaming all Hispanics because just a few of them are refusing to learn English! I do think it's important for them to adapt but I also think it's important for elementary children to learn a secondary language and it doesn't have to be Spanish! You teach them Japanese,Italian,German!

DounutHole
12/19/16 10:50 pm

Amy, twenty one country's primary language is Spanish. Wherever I go, whenever I travel, most people speak two or three languages. I suggest you open your eyes πŸ‘€

LaReine Communist Lesbian
12/18/16 4:21 pm

Preferably an artificial philosphical language.

ProbablyEug Oakland
12/18/16 3:48 pm

Learning a second language stimulates the brain!

Reply
Hunter512x Kentucky Libertarian
12/18/16 3:32 pm

The Spanish language in particular is becoming more and more prevalent in the United States as the years go by. If you want to include any language in elementary curriculum, make it Spanish, as it will naturally be the most useful and have the greatest number of teachers available. If you can find the teachers for any other languages, make those languages an alternative.

Reply
BossHogg Kentucky
12/18/16 3:07 pm

No, this is America. The kids have a hard enough time with English these days.

Reply
bluerum29 optimistic idealist
12/18/16 12:42 pm

I have no desire to learn.amother language.

Reply
GlockMan1 Alabama
12/18/16 12:27 pm

I would prefer that they learn how to write a check and balance a checkbook.

Reply
Genome Praise Poseidon
12/18/16 12:33 pm

As elementary children?

mudkip17 United States of Texas
12/18/16 3:07 pm

That's pretty outdated.. I mean I still write a check for rent, but if it wasn't for that I'd have no need for a checkbook at all. More and more places are refusing to even take checks

firefly5 the verse
12/18/16 9:22 pm

True story. I haven't used a personal check in a long time. And there are far more useful skills to learn. Applying for a job, filing taxes, basics of personal finance... not in elementary school, though. I like the foreign language there.

DounutHole
12/19/16 10:54 pm

Glock, checks are sooooo 1990's. The only folks I see using them are elderly old ladies.

ladyniner81 Embrace your inner dork
12/20/16 11:46 pm

I refuse to do online banking. I don't trust people.

mudkip17 United States of Texas
12/20/16 11:48 pm

Everything you give someone a check you hand them your account and routing number.. I feel online banking is tons safer than that

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
12/18/16 12:13 pm

Expose them to other languages as early & often as possible, it will be a benefit to them all there livesπŸ‘πŸ»β—

Reply
bobbabson Conneticut
12/18/16 10:29 am

I started learning Spanish in second grade and took it all the way through highschool

Reply
TheHand If you need a hand
12/18/16 8:56 am

Konnichiwa, Guten Morgen! Bienvenidos!
Second and third languages are underestimated. With the globalization that is occurring it is essential to grasp the languages of immigrants and those abroad. This basically facilitates common ground and initially breaks down cultural barriers associated with linguistic disparity.
Even non-fluency can open doors to new avenues of communication with a foreigner. (Not the Rock Band).
If you are in business having the ability to discuss directly without the need for translation alleviates the frustration.
Capisce? Bueno! Danke Shon! Ciao! Syonara!
Yoi ichinichi o! Buenos Dias!
Via con Dios!

Reply
RagingMystic covfefe
12/18/16 1:21 pm

Plus, I don't have specifics but they're an easy Google search away, learning a second language is proven to help brain development in areas that control things like critical thinking

TheHand If you need a hand
12/18/16 2:16 pm

I was scrolling back to see your prior post that you are following up on with "Plus".
I don't see anything prior so I guess you are delirious or on something.
Why don't you put the pipe down?

moldypipes9
12/18/16 7:06 am

Anyone who thinks it is a bad thing to learn other languages is a complete fool. I wish I knew other languages. When u travel to Europe, u really feel like a stupid American when all u know is English. Knowing multiple languages can NEVER EVER b a bad thing.

Reply
TheHand If you need a hand
12/18/16 8:28 am

I agree 100% you stupid American, lol.

SHIPPY1944 Tn.
12/18/16 12:19 pm

Moldy, use the translator app on your iPhone or the free Babbel app which will help you learn another languageπŸ‘πŸ»

Irish12
12/18/16 3:37 am

Why teach 5-6 year olds a foreign language when at this rate they have only barely grasped English?! That's what put me off learning another language.

Reply
Gundens
12/18/16 6:52 am

Because it's easier to start learning languages at a younger age. You don't have to perfect English before you start learning another language, in fact studies show it's more productive for both languages if you study them at the same time

Gundens
12/18/16 6:52 am

And the fact is there's still "English classes" in college, so at that point, no time to even learn Spanish. Need to do it early.

CDFL alt right, alt snowflake
12/18/16 10:04 am

^very true on all points. Much easier to learn 2 as a kid and does not affect learning rate.

And, trying to pick up a new language in college as I did this past semester was an utter failure as an engineering major. No time and no patience, I ended up dropping the class within weeks

RagingMystic covfefe
12/18/16 1:22 pm

Little kids brains are actually set up for learning languages, and that ability diminishes as they get older, so the best time to learn a second language is at 2

peacenskis Alaska
12/19/16 12:26 am

I am guessing that you are very young

RagingMystic covfefe
12/19/16 12:38 am

The brain develops all kinds of neurons to everywhere briefly after birth, giving children unprecedented fluid intelligence. As they get older, there's a process known a synaptic pruning where it cuts unused neurons and reinforces the connections between more frequently used ones. This is why activities that were normally difficult become second nature, but it comes at the cost of speed and ability to absorb new information

PepeSupremacy
12/18/16 2:12 am

Why learn a language you will most likely only use a handful of times. Unless you plan for your child to move to a different country there is no need. Just a waste of time and energy. And what kid even wants to learn a second language.

Gundens
12/18/16 6:54 am

A lot of ones that want to learn a second language realize they will be at an advantage in resumes and the job markets in the future if they are bi lingual.

Henry123 Connecticut
12/18/16 11:18 am

Also being bilingual is very good for the brain and your mental abilities. I don't know all the details but look into it it's always a positive to know more than one language

mudkip17 United States of Texas
12/18/16 3:10 pm

If it comes down between you and another job applicant for the same job, being bi lingual is often the distinguishing factor between getting the job and being passed up

geddy Colorado
12/17/16 11:49 pm

I picked my kids' elementary school because it taught a foreign language.

Reply
NexusBlue California
12/17/16 11:32 pm

That would be the time to learn one. Kids learn faster than adults in that area. I WISH I was bilingual. German would be my first choice.

Reply
NinerNation Conservatarian
12/17/16 10:49 pm

Only Spanish, all the other languages are pointless

Reply
Loxx I Love Foxes
12/17/16 11:09 pm

French>>>>>Spanish

peacenskis Alaska
12/17/16 10:28 pm

I can't understand why it folks on here don't want our kids to learn Spanish? Alaskan elementary students can choose from different charter schools that include a second language. My nephews learn Spanish in K-6. My niece is doing a Japanese immersion program in a K-6 school. I know that we also have a full Russian immersion program. Many of our villages teach their native language to the next generation and many households are bilingual. Yupik, Tlingit and Aleut are a couple of examples. I'm sure there are many other options. These are just the ones I know about without looking into it. We are usually a little behind the times here in Alaska, so I imagine there are many language immersion programs available in the contiguous 48 states that include a language other than Spanish. Working in the medical field, Spanish is the most common language I need someone to interpret. If you are bilingual in the US, Spanish would be the most relevant.

Reply
akrealist a log cabin in the woods
12/18/16 8:15 am

For me, the most common translation issues I run into (also in Alaska) are Russian and sign language. That said, my son took Spanish in the public school system here in Alaska and uses it now that he lives in Florida.

When I lived in the Midwest and managed facilities in the US and Canada...I needed French (which I took in school in Michigan).

When I lived in Florida and Texas...by far...the need was Spanish.

I think learning a language at an early age - especially a romantic language - can really help you if you need to adapt to other languages later. Latin isn't a bad choice either!

thewellfish
12/17/16 9:54 pm

They should be learning to perfect their English first before they start learning another language. Especially Spanish.

Reply
CDFL alt right, alt snowflake
12/17/16 10:34 pm

Yeah, that's not how kids work. They can easily learn 2 or more languages concurrently, much faster than they would be able to later in life

STEVE64 Michigan
12/18/16 9:37 am

Alright someone's gotta ask. Why especially Spanish?

CDFL alt right, alt snowflake
12/18/16 10:02 am

I wasn't even going to address that, I'm sure it's the "they can speak English stop ramming Spanish down our throats" bs πŸ™„

adamw Ohio
12/17/16 9:35 pm

Young kids learn other languages fairly easily, and learning a second language can often help with grammar in English.

Reply
Asylumfries
12/17/16 9:48 pm

But in Elementary you go to all your classes together, so every kid would learn spanish, (most likely) instead of learning other languages or getting to choose.

adamw Ohio
12/17/16 9:51 pm

I assumed it would be similar to gym or music classes where kids go somewhere else. I don't really have a problem with people all learning the same language.

Asylumfries
12/17/16 9:54 pm

But it would just become another dreaded subject you have to sit through, like music for the kids who can't sing and art for the kids who can't draw.

adamw Ohio
12/17/16 10:01 pm

That seems like it comes down to the quality of the teacher more than anything else. As one of the kids who can't draw I don't think we should get rid of art classes either

Asylumfries
12/17/16 10:03 pm

No we shouldn't get rid of art, but adding more classes you can't choose doesn't make sense.

adamw Ohio
12/17/16 10:06 pm

It helps kids learn languages later in life and often helps with their English skills to. That'd be the reason. Kids don't get to choose any of the classes they take at that age and a lot of them will probably enjoy that more than their other classes

Asylumfries
12/17/16 10:11 pm

Possibly. But is it worth it because adding a class takes away time from other subjects.

adamw Ohio
12/17/16 10:12 pm

Personally I think it is, but I could see why if you think differently

Asylumfries
12/17/16 10:14 pm

I can see why you think it should be added.

celloVirtuoso buried in sheet music
12/17/16 9:29 pm

I don't see why not, since many high schools across the nation require a certain number of years in a foreign language class in order to graduate, and most good post-secondary institutions prefer students who have taken a foreign language for a certain number of years, as well. Being fluent in 2 or more languages is definitely a useful skill, and if it's going to be required at some point, why not begin preparing the kids while they're younger and their brains are wired to learn it quicker. Most developed foreign nations have students begin learning a second language early on, and by high school students are on to their 3rd and 4th language if they choose to continue to learn more languages. I personally can't see any significant down sides to having our kids learn a second language of their choosing (or of the parents' choosing).

Reply
kenzbt New York
12/17/16 9:07 pm

Sure.....anything but Spanish!

Reply
kenzbt New York
12/17/16 9:19 pm

Because it's being forced down our throats.

peacenskis Alaska
12/17/16 10:20 pm

Because it is the most relevant second language to know living in the United States. Working in medical field, I regularly have to find someone who speaks Spanish to help out and I live nowhere near a Spanish-speaking border.

CDFL alt right, alt snowflake
12/17/16 10:36 pm

Yeah, don't know where you live but everywhere I've lived Spanish is spoken regularly around me. It's the most relevant second language in the US

sweetnes34 Outta Phucks
12/18/16 5:26 am

Yea! I don't want to learn something just because they think it's for the betterment of all!! Damn them forcing math & grammar down my throat too! :/ they should have taught us the metric system 30 years ago too. Get over it. It's a global world now and if you can't communicate the evolution of the population will just leave you behind.

HilfeRetteMich Delaware
12/17/16 9:04 pm

I moved to the US at a year old, but primarily spoke German until I was 5. I couldn't be more grateful, because my German is still fluent. Being bilingual is so valuable! I spent 9th grade back in Germany to freshen up on the language, and many of my classmates spoke Spanish and French as well as English.

Reply
Gunfighter06 Iowa, since 1846
12/17/16 8:39 pm

People complaining on here about forgetting a foreign language either didn't practice enough or tried to learn it too late in their lives. Middle school/high school is too late to learn a second language.

If we teach it earlier, kids will retain it better. It's a psychological fact. Your language synapses start to "prune" themselves permanently before adolescence.

Reply
PeppyHare Do a barrel roll
12/17/16 8:33 pm

I took Spanish for 3 years. I can't say I know or remember any of it. I've never had to use it. It was a waste.

Reply
PeppyHare Do a barrel roll
12/17/16 8:36 pm

The reason the US tends to only know one language is that most people only have a need for one language. Go to Europe and they complain about the British not knowing their language and expecting everyone else to know English.

dudley northern Virginia woods
12/17/16 8:31 pm

If English is taught as a second language, then that other language should be taught to kids who speak English. Student body would be more cohesive. Kids are mentally more prepared to learn a foreign language at a very early age (3-7). And there's also the equal education issue. I lived in Spain for a year and would borrow a five year old to go grocery shopping to act as a translator. Little language sponges.

Reply
themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 8:21 pm

Growing up in South Louisiana we had Cajun French classes. Do I remember most of it? No. Can I still curse in French? Weh.

dudley northern Virginia woods
12/17/16 8:26 pm

That is extremely cool. The Cajun accent ks fun to listen to as well. It's musical.

themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 8:48 pm

It's my grandparent's first language. It's a shame that it's a dying language.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 8:52 pm

It's spelled oui by the way (if you weren't just being funny). I took about 5 years of French and it's one of the few words I remember.

themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 8:55 pm

Oui is 'yes' in French. There's a difference (although slight) between Cajun French and French. I still may have spelled it wrong but it's pronounced as "weh" and not "we".

themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 9:06 pm

Ok as I'm rereading this I can see how 'weh' can be mistakenly pronounced. The 'e' is pronounced as 'eh'. So it's w-eh. If that makes sense.

themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 9:07 pm

Mistakenly pronounced as 'we' that is.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 9:16 pm

I always thought the biggest differences were in pronunciations and not spellings! Learn something new everyday 😊 I figured it might be something like that, so that's why I tried to say it in the least know it all way because I didn't want it to come across like that πŸ˜‚

themahcrow Louisiana
12/17/16 9:36 pm

Honestly I'm not sure if I'm spelling it correctly. I can't speak it fluently but can pick apart pieces of conversation. I mostly know the little I do know from my grandparents and the older people where I grew up. All of the older generations know the language well, it's just dying with the younger generations.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 11:53 pm

That's so sad! Schools should emphasis it more.

tyvee32 Ohio
12/17/16 8:10 pm

Should definitely be a public option

ptellini
12/17/16 7:29 pm

Only as an elective.

Reply
Zauz
12/17/16 7:03 pm

I had to learn English in 3rd grade because I had moved to America

Reply
iceberg124
12/17/16 6:48 pm

Should be learning Spanish. It's a lot more valuable than the worthless superintendents and administrations the teachers unions are hiring

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 6:56 pm

?? Teachers' Unions don't hire administrators, and superintendents are elected. I agree that most of them are worthless, though.

iceberg124
12/17/16 7:42 pm

Teachers union often has leverage in negotiating with the Board which many times allowed them to go out of control with spending and not defend teachers. Superintendents may be elected but my comment was about the amount of them there are. For example my town has 3 superintendents, a dozen+ administrators, there is 3 high schools, maybe 8 elementary schools, the teachers are making 70k and the bureaucrats easily 110+ , the school taxes are ridiculous. For reference NYC school district has 1 superintendent, which the schools may be terrible but they are a lot more fair especially to people without kids.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 8:54 pm

Superintendents aren't elected everywhere by the way.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 6:39 pm

No. Students shouldn't be forced to learn a specific subject, even though I greatly value foreign language.

Reply
JMask California
12/17/16 6:48 pm

So if a third grader doesn't want to learn math, the school should just say "okay you don't have to learn math"?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 7:52 pm

I'm not a troll. Just more libertarian than most libertarians.

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 8:02 pm

I hated math, but even I can see the value. That's pretty extreme, Doc!

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 8:16 pm

I imagine you don't need a class to learn the basics, just an open mind and open eyes to the world around you.

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 8:55 pm

Dunno about that. My 7-year-old is having a hard time just picking up addition and subtraction...and she's normal.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 8:59 pm

Maybe you're right. At the very least I don't think we need compulsion in order for people to learn this stuff.

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 10:06 pm

Wouldn't that undermine the whole premise of a public education system...that everyone, regardless of background, is provided with the basic skills needed for functionality, advancement, and success?

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 10:08 pm

I can't believe I'm arguing FOR math, but I think that's a pretty vital skill...everyone at least has to know how to count money and balance their checkbook.

akrealist a log cabin in the woods
12/18/16 8:34 am

Not teaching (and requiring) basic math skills to a child just because the child doesn't want to is negligent on the teacher's/parent's part.

Not everyone needs calculus, I'll give you, but everyone (who is capable) should be taught the skills to read and follow a recipe (fractions), balance their checkbook (add/subtract), understand a loan or credit terms (percentages/compounding)...and so many other things. Relying on immersion for basic math skills is the long way to the water cooler...and assumes they are "immersed" in the right environment, in the right pattern, to figure it out. That's an experiment we shouldn't risk (for them.)

ptellini
12/18/16 8:38 am

An argument against teaching math is either one in ignorance or just being a troll.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 9:08 am

Remove compulsion, you honestly think we would be stuck with a population that can't do basic math? I think you need to support that claim better.

ptellini
12/18/16 9:10 am

I can't see any valid argument against having math in basic curriculum.

phalnx Ohio
12/18/16 9:16 am

There are still people even in the US who are functionally illiterate. It's not that they can't learn...they were never forced to. They may be able to get by, but man, what a desolate existence! I think Math is about as basic as reading.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 9:20 am

We have compulsion in education across the entire country, yet you're right - we have a relatively high illiteracy rate. Maybe we should try something different. Removing compulsion will make students more inclined to learn because school will no longer be a place of oppression and hierarchy.

ptellini
12/18/16 9:27 am

I think the bottom line is parents need to be more involved.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 9:29 am

How do you get parents more involved?

ptellini
12/18/16 9:44 am

Do you have any ideas?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 1:29 pm

No, I don't. I stand by the idea that the most fundamental issue with our education system is compulsion. Students don't like compulsion. No one likes compulsion. People want freedom.

ptellini
12/18/16 1:32 pm

Do you think children are mature enough to make educational decisions?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 1:35 pm

I think in a society where they are not intentionally repressed and creativity is encouraged they would be very competent human beings.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 1:35 pm

Why do you think kids don't like going to school?

ptellini
12/18/16 1:38 pm

In your first comment it sounds like you're talking about education versus indoctrination. If that is the case then I perhaps agree.
I didn't like school. I didn't like being told what to do or given work to do. I just wanted to have fun.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 1:57 pm

Indoctrination is one aspect of why I don't think we should compulsion in education, but it's not my preferred argument. I believe compulsion causes students to dislike education. Students will learn better if they choose to be there. And they will choose to be there if there is no compulsion. They cannot choose to be there if they are compulsed.

ptellini
12/18/16 1:59 pm

How do you propose we educate children?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 2:01 pm

I believe education should be a service provided by ones community, but one should not be forced to attend.

ptellini
12/18/16 2:05 pm

A child should not be forced to go to school?

ptellini
12/18/16 2:51 pm

Then the child might not get an education.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 2:54 pm

Yes, he will. But he won't learn stuff that he doesn't find liberating and which doesn't permit him to fulfill his creative impulses.

ptellini
12/18/16 2:58 pm

So you're saying a child should be able to decide what their curriculum is composed of.

akrealist a log cabin in the woods
12/18/16 3:38 pm

For Pete's sake, DoctorW, that is absurd. Children count on adults to raise them...to guide them through learning the basic skills they will need to survive. That includes math in every circumstance.

If they want to take piano, or take interpretive dance, well great. But not instead of math.

phalnx Ohio
12/18/16 4:05 pm

I agree with ak...if left to my own devices, I would've played with my friends and my Atari/C64 all day. It would've been summer vacation all year long. We're engineered to do our best work under compulsion (deadlines, etc.).

phalnx Ohio
12/18/16 4:09 pm

I really haven't accomplished jack in life since graduating from college, because I haven't been forced to...life came a little too easy for me. Kids especially need motivation, because learning is sometimes painful and hard even when you love it.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 4:32 pm

Ak- adults should guide kids, yes. But unless the kids are in physical danger, I think adults should refrain from compulsion. Lead, not drag.

ptellini
12/18/16 4:35 pm

Some children need to be dragged. How do you know a child knows what's best for him or her?

ptellini
12/18/16 4:40 pm

Dr: this makes me curious how old you are and if you have any children.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 4:51 pm

I don't have any kids. But I still believe that if you don't use compulsion against a kid, they're more likely to be a functioning member of society be treating others the way they were being treated.

ptellini
12/18/16 5:09 pm

I could not disagree more and I have children.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 5:43 pm

Neither of us have any experience raising kids in a society without compulsion.

ptellini
12/18/16 5:46 pm

I have more experience being a parent than you do. Children need structure. Children are not mature enough to make decisions that are right for their life. That is why they have parents to raise them.

phalnx Ohio
12/18/16 7:51 pm

I agree with ptellini...you have to learn the system before rebelling against it. There is, however, the Montessori educational approach that may be a fairly agreeable compromise, Doctor. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montessori_education

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 8:12 pm

I do generally agree with the Montessori education. I'd like to see that expanded as the institutional educational system.

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 8:13 pm

But, phalnx, we're discussing the education system, not parenting. I have plenty experience as a student in the education system.

ptellini
12/19/16 5:01 am

I took a look and believe it has merit, however, it is up to the parents to decide what educational system the child should be in.
As long as the curriculum includes math, English, real science and real history.

phalnx Ohio
12/19/16 3:45 pm

Actually, Doc, parenting and the educational system are inseparable...kids need both integrated. Teachers alone can't educate a child, and parents alone shouldn't...unless they're trained as teachers.

ptellini
12/19/16 3:48 pm

I don't believe parents need to be trained as teachers did you teach the children. I know plenty of children that get homeschooled by parents that are not trained and they are excellent examples of why homeschooling is such a good thing.

akrealist a log cabin in the woods
12/20/16 7:28 am

I think I can speak further to this as I both attended Montessori (as a student) AND raised three children now all in college.

Montessori approach does work, but it still has expectations of competency for basic skills. The open learning style is more about removing barriers to explore the areas you enjoy /and or excel in, and using-while-learning approaches to problem solving. It does not (and shouldn't) allow for avoidance of reading, writing, or basic math...(or in my case, French!)

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/20/16 9:13 am

Thank you for sharing your experience. What I've suggested is that basic math and literacy won't be lost in a situation where students are given more liberty.

MrsCrayonWax
12/17/16 6:28 pm

When you look at other countries and the multiple languages spoken, why wouldn't we want the same for our kids?

Reply
keyboardwarrior Illinois
12/17/16 6:47 pm

Those countries speak other languages because they have to use them. It's difficult to learn hear because there is no immersion.

MrsCrayonWax
12/17/16 6:58 pm

So we shouldn't offer additional languages?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 7:21 pm

Offering is different from adding it to the curriculum.

MrsCrayonWax
12/17/16 7:41 pm

I think it could be done at a very rudimentary level if it was to be done.

CoffeeNow Fiery but peaceful rioter
12/17/16 8:02 pm

It's coming at the expense of something else. Without immersion, you're going to need years, maybe decades of a language. That's time not spent on math, science, etc

And for what? So they can communicate without an app when they spend a summer abroad? It's a luxury.

MrsCrayonWax
12/18/16 1:44 am

I'd have to agree with you. The system is broken and needs the basics fixed first before it's mandated.

b4mytime Orange County, CA
12/17/16 6:12 pm

Yes! In fact, this would help them to better understand English grammar.

Reply
corino Utah
12/17/16 6:10 pm

If you've got a smart kid and good parental support great! They're probably bored anyway. However, language emersion can cause them to fall behind in other subjects and can make it difficult to discuss things like math with english speaking students. And there are a lot of schools without the support they need, financial or parental. Some title 9 schools should consider it an accomplishment if the kids learn to read and eat lunch daily.

Reply
DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/17/16 6:38 pm

What about libertarianism?

DoctorWasdarb Marxist Leninist Maoist
12/18/16 8:57 am

Why should students be forced to learn anything in school?

CTYankee!!! Connecticut
12/17/16 6:05 pm

Chinese would be a smart language to start teaching our children.

Reply
FloridaPopulist Nationalist Right
12/17/16 10:51 pm

Mandarin* you damn nazi

Senate101 San Diego
12/17/16 5:52 pm

Spanish in grades 1-5 made high school Spanish much easier.

Reply
Zod Above Pugetropolis
12/17/16 5:52 pm

Probably, since learning a second or third language helps learn the first (and others). But which one? Seems like if they need it and use it, at home or in the neighborhood, they'll pick it up.

Reply
Loxx I Love Foxes
12/17/16 5:51 pm

Allow the child to pick the language rather than forcing Spanish.

Reply
rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/17/16 6:06 pm

Agree I suppose but it's the second most useful language in this country

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/17/16 8:07 pm

I was forced to take Spanish in middle school and I hated it. I chose french in high school and I love it. Forcing a child to learn something never turns out very good

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 9:00 pm

In elementary school, I feel like most kids wouldn't have a strong preference. It would also be expensive to have both. I agree to give options later, but starting a 5 year old out with Spanish doesn't seem so bad.

I had some very basic Spanish in kindergarten. I think they must've cut funding or something because it stopped after that. We didn't have languages offered again until high school and I chose French.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/17/16 9:19 pm

And you've likely never used it in the real world. There's something to be said for letting kids choose but honestly taking French in high school is the equivalent to underwater basket weaving in college. You'll probably go and get a music degree or something dumb.

- Took two years of Spanish in high school and four years of French from Jr high on. I've used the French once in my life.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 9:26 pm

Personally, in my field, French is more valuable. I planned on minoring in it in college until I got to college and realized I really suck at learning languages. (I think it was due to some memory loss due to chemo my senior year of high school, but that's just speculation. I couldn't remember anything for months and my memory has never fully recovered.) That being said though, I planned on learning at least two more languages after perfecting my French. Spanish probably would've been one.

I think Chinese should be the default second option instead of French. I think it is just because it's a Romance language, easy to learn and a large amount of English words derive from it.

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/17/16 10:32 pm

I've used it a lot actually. Also if you want to go into international business french is usually a better choice than Spanish.

brinrawson Knoxville and DC
12/17/16 11:50 pm

I'll expand my saying my field uses French more by saying it is international business, so I definitely agree with Loxx πŸ˜‚

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/17/16 11:56 pm

French is the go to language for diplomats and businessmen due to its formality, clarity, and precision.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/18/16 6:09 am

Laxx, what are you talking about. No it isn't. English is. More useful languages after that for what you cited are Chinese, Russian, and Arabic.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/18/16 6:11 am

And no, French is not preferred to Spanish for international business. It simply isn't. Chinese, Russian, and Spanish are all above French. Even Portuguese is ranked more influential than French. You know why?

Because the only economies that speak French outside of France and mud hut African countries. There's precisely ZERO application for it outside of France.

Learn it if you want, again I took it for four years and only used it on my honeymoon some 15 years later. Just don't delude yourself into thinking it's more useful than it is.

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/18/16 10:31 am

More nations speak French than Spanish, also the population of French speaking african nations is booming and they're developing fairly quickly.

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/18/16 10:35 am

French: Belgium, Benin, Burkina, Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Canada, Central, African, Republic, Chad, Comoros, Côte, d'Ivoire, Democratic, Republic, of, the, Congo, Djibouti, Equatorial, Guinea, France, Guinea, Haiti, Luxembourg, Madagascar, Mali, Monaco, Niger, Republic, of, the, Congo, Rwanda, Senegal, Seychelles, Switzerland, Togo, and Vanuatu.

Spanish:Argentina, Bolivia, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Equatorial Guinea, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras, Mexico, Nicaragua, Panama, Paraguay, Peru, Puerto Rico, Spain, Uruguay, and Venezuela.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/18/16 1:06 pm

Sorry, you're just wrong if you think that today French is more prevalent than any of Spanish, Chinese, Russian, or Arabic

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/18/16 5:37 pm

Well considering Africa's growing birth rate and increasing development French will likely surpass Spanish soon

Loxx I Love Foxes
12/18/16 9:11 pm

According to www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?v=25 nations such as Niger, Mali, Burkina Faso, and Burundi (all french speaking nations) have a birth rate of over 40 many other french african nations have birthrates of over 30. While the highest birthrate in any Hispanic nation is Guatemala with a birthrate of 25. The birthrate of all Hispanic countries have also fallen within the past few decades.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/19/16 4:39 am

Good talk.

You still haven't proven your claim that today, french is a better language to know for international business.

Xemanis Neutral Good
12/17/16 5:46 pm

Nope. I took 4 Spanish classes in 8th grade through 11th grade.

It didn't help at all.

I was forced to take it and I learned nothing.

Reply
Xemanis Neutral Good
12/17/16 5:47 pm

Plus this is America, where we speak English. It isn't necessary to make it a mandatory class.

Crawdaddy11 MIMNAZMN
12/17/16 5:50 pm

Well at least now you speak 4 languages

PrinceOberyn Io Himeros
12/17/16 5:50 pm

"This is America, where we speak English"

No.

This is America, where we have no established language but the majority speak English. However, a good 17% of whom speak Spanish at home. We're a multicultural, multilingual empire.

May also recommend Duolingo as an alternative to classes if you'd like to learn again? It's pretty good and free (still, I hope, its been awhile since I used it).

Xemanis Neutral Good
12/17/16 6:00 pm

I'm not really interested in it right now, but thanks for the recommendation.

I said it isn't really necessary given that the majority speaks English and that the programs aren't known to work.

rebelfury76 F Trump, F his idiot cult
12/17/16 6:07 pm

Xem you need to go outside the state once

PrinceOberyn Io Himeros
12/17/16 6:13 pm

Worked for me. I didn't use Duolingo until about a year ago, and that's for Italian. Classwork in Highschool taught me enseñó a leer y escribir en español, and college classwork has left me litteratorie scilicet vetere Latina lingua.

Classwork in a subject should not be discredited, but definitely requires better teaching than memorization, tbh.

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 6:18 pm

No, Prince and rebel, we're English-speaking. The Austro-Hungarian empire's military spoke seven languages, and embarrassed themselves on the field. Ours speaks one. If people want to get ahead in this country, they speak it.

Xemanis Neutral Good
12/17/16 6:19 pm

Classwork doesn't help if the teachers aren't competent
A very recurring theme where I live. People tend to get out Scott free because nobody cares though .

CoffeeNow Fiery but peaceful rioter
12/17/16 6:42 pm

Some people seem to legitimately have a problem promoting English as the country's language. It's weird

CoffeeNow Fiery but peaceful rioter
12/17/16 6:51 pm

It's a recent phenomenon. It used to just be common sense that everyone agreed on...speaking one language is helpful. But like everything, it has become politicized and now many edgy teens see a republican promoting English as the official language (the horror) and they immediately think "this must be bad. I'm against this."

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 6:53 pm

I think some people equate monolingualism with xenophobia. Not true at all. Foreign languages are like anything else...you learn them when/if you need them, which the majority of us don't. I have two uncles and a cousin who know Arabic because

phalnx Ohio
12/17/16 6:54 pm

they were stationed in the Middle-East and had to learn it. It's no big deal.

CoffeeNow Fiery but peaceful rioter
12/17/16 6:55 pm

Exactly. Language's purpose is to communicate. If everyone speaks the same language, more communication, less misunderstanding, more harmony.

Crawdaddy11 MIMNAZMN
12/17/16 7:01 pm

Indubitably!

PrinceOberyn Io Himeros
12/17/16 5:43 pm

Yep. Our country is vastly diverse, and the world is globalizing whether you like it or not. Second languages are inherently useful.

Reply
IDontCare1999
12/17/16 5:42 pm

I live in AMERICA and we speak ENGLISH. I wont even talk to someone if they dont speak ENGLISH.

Reply
Crawdaddy11 MIMNAZMN
12/17/16 5:52 pm

I won't even LOOK at someone if they don't speak English!

NewGeneration Washington DC
12/17/16 6:41 pm

What kind of education do you both have? Just curious.

Crawdaddy11 MIMNAZMN
12/17/16 6:59 pm

I don't know about this racist but most of my education comes from Fox News an other right wing liberal media

abuehrer1
12/17/16 5:39 pm

It would make high school foreign languages classes a lot more useful.

Reply