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ScottyDoesNo July 2nd, 2013 9:45pm

With 55% of Americans receiving some form of government aid, should the coming July 4th celebration be called Independence Day or "Dependence" Day?

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pipes
07/03/13 9:11 am

Scotty, aw you just a trol?

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/03/13 9:57 am

Oh c'mon, you know this was a clever and thought-provoking question. Don't be jelly because you didn't come up with it first. :-)

XercesBlue ...
07/03/13 8:19 am

Independence Day is a celebration of the anniversary of our Nation's declaration of independence statehood..

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XercesBlue ...
07/03/13 8:20 am

.. Not the current state of our country.

think4yourself Not a safe space
07/02/13 8:51 pm

Government is ripping off people on social security. The same amount of money invested over the years in a low performing investment would now be paying you more than twice as much as the government does.

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ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/03/13 8:34 am

Exactly, take 15% of your lifetime income that the government steals and run a calculator on how much that would be after being in even a crappy investment over 40 years. Warning, you will cry when you see how much money you've been cheated out of.

GrandmaALiCE For a better 2021
07/02/13 7:40 pm

So, are you counting me in the 55%? My husband and I are both on Social Security and Medicare.

Of course, we paid into the system for many years. Also, we still pay a lot of taxes - income tax, real estate tax, sales tax and more.

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GrandmaALiCE For a better 2021
07/02/13 7:42 pm

I haven't calculated exactly, but I am fairly sure that we pay more in various taxes than we receive in benefits.

So, I ask you again ... Do you count my husband and myself, as being "on the dole"?

corino Utah
07/02/13 10:03 pm

My newborn son got social security benefits, he's never paid into the system. But I've paid into it more than I will probably ever get out. I don't believe it's a bad thing to be part of that 55%, unless it's a lifestyle choice.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/03/13 4:45 am

This whole "well I paid into the system" argument blinds people to the truth. All that money that was stolen from you, had you been allowed to keep and invest it yourself, your return would have been far greater.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/03/13 4:46 am

Instead of the measly $1-1.5k per month you'd have more like $5-6k *and* you would get to keep the nest egg and pass along to your heirs whereas the government steals your money to keep the Ponzi scheme going.

corino Utah
07/03/13 9:51 am

Not everyone would save and invest given the option. Also saving and investing doesn't add up if you find yourself on disability half way through your career.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/03/13 9:55 am

You're absolutely right, not everyone would save. But not everyone brushes their teeth either. It's not your or my responsibility to make people do the right thing.

HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 6:58 pm

My Bible teacher actually compared this to the slaves in Egypt during the time of Moses.

Once they got out of Egypt, they actually complained and wanted to to back. It was easier there because they were provided food and a bed.

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HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 6:59 pm

It takes work to become independent.

dudley northern Virginia woods
07/02/13 6:31 pm

It's not about us. It's about a dream, an ideal, a goal.

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corino Utah
07/02/13 5:02 pm

Define government aide.

Right now the US government provides a nuclear deterrent that prevents any rational country from going to war with us. Nobody got nuked yesterday, you're welcome and you are part of the 100+% dependent on the government.

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corino Utah
07/02/13 10:01 pm

My local government like every local government this summer is fixing roads. I need roads to get to work. I don't know how to build roads. I pay an unmeasurably small amount for a road I don't have the time/money to build. Man I'm so dependant!

kcam1390
07/02/13 4:21 pm

So glad I work so hard for everyone else!

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kateXcore Dark side of the moon
07/02/13 3:42 pm

I don't know about calling it Dependence Day, but I certainly don't think it should be Independence Day. It is a celebration of us being a free people. Our government is oppressive, so we are no longer free, so what are we celebrating? That we...

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kateXcore Dark side of the moon
07/02/13 3:43 pm

were once free? Keep that in your mind while you watch your fireworks and grill your hot dogs...

TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/02/13 3:24 pm

It was 47% during the campaign, but that included pensioners and social security recipients (I'm ok with considering SSDI as welfare).

Where did you get 55%?

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TempName14 Everywhere but nowhere
07/02/13 3:28 pm

27% was the real number of people "on the dole."

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 3:48 pm

Census Bureau data as reported by The Washington Post.

EarlyBird Portland
07/02/13 3:12 pm

Scotty, Scotty, Scotty...

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ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 3:48 pm

You know you can't get enough of me!

pipes
07/02/13 3:10 pm

Its called independence day because we declared independence from england.The day is supposed to commemorate the founding of America, not its current state, if that's how how you think our current state is. So no of course not.

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rlands
07/02/13 3:16 pm

I don't believe this.

pipes
07/03/13 8:33 am

She doesn't believe that I follow scotty.

Liberty 4,032,064
07/02/13 3:08 pm

I think it should be called "Delusion Day" or "Fascism Day."
Most people either "celebrate our freedom" or worship the military, rather than commemorating the secession. Complete garbage.

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rlands
07/02/13 3:17 pm

So what would you prefer to celebrate?

Liberty 4,032,064
07/02/13 3:20 pm

I would prefer to commemorate the secession, not lie to myself about the current state of affairs.

rlands
07/02/13 3:24 pm

Wouldn't that constitute trying to '"celebrate our freedom"'?

Liberty 4,032,064
07/02/13 3:29 pm

I'm referring to those that think the U.S. is some magical fairy land where everything is great and we're not all slaves to government.

rlands
07/02/13 4:11 pm

It's pretty outstanding. None of us are slaves to the government. If you can't recognize that, I'm very sorry but try living anywhere else.

Liberty 4,032,064
07/02/13 4:15 pm

Try keeping all of your income and tell me if you own yourself.
Try building on your own property and tell me if you own your own land.

electricelise
07/02/13 6:20 pm

Liberty4: FTW! Couldn't have said it better myself. It is sickening how all of the commie/ socialist a**holes are taking over the govt. and people think everything is great because we have clean water. This is not how this country was meant to be!!

rlands
07/02/13 2:56 pm

This is what a government is supposed to do...it's functioning as it should in that respect.

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ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 3:53 pm

46 million Americans on food stamps is "functioning as it should"? 99 weeks of unemployment is "functioning as it should"? 60% of Americans receiving more in government benefits than they paid in taxes is "functioning as it should"?

rlands
07/02/13 4:11 pm

Ya. The government is supposed to provide for the less fortunate. It's great.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 4:16 pm

So *two years* of unemployment checks is "providing for the less fortunate"? I think it's people who are getting paid to not work and thus not motivated to seek employment. Can't say I blame'em, but this is the very definition of dependence.

rlands
07/02/13 4:17 pm

Some people can't just go out and get work. It's nice to have a safety net. And the government should provide that.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 4:20 pm

Really? There's not a McDonald's on every freakin' corner that needs their burgers flipped? The problem with unemployment is that it pays better than that burger flipper job so again, people aren't motivated to seek employment.

rlands
07/02/13 4:26 pm

A qualified person isn't going to go to get a job at McDonald's. and I still think welfare is something we should pride out country on.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 5:25 pm

Oh I know, people think they're "too good" for McDonald's when they lose their prestigious job. Well how about you man up and do what is necessary to support your family? But again, unemployment pays better so why bother?

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 5:25 pm

And we should be *proud* of welfare? Did you really just say that? I mean, seriously?

rlands
07/02/13 5:26 pm

Yeah. It's great that we're able to do that. Very commendable.

electricelise
07/02/13 6:14 pm

Rlands: I just face palmed about a billion times at your comments. Ugh *facepalm*

electricelise
07/02/13 6:16 pm

It is not the governments job to be involved. If someone needs money, they should go get a job. Nothing is free in life, where do u think the government gets the money to pay for welfare and unemployment programs?? Taxpayers like you and me!!!!

electricelise
07/02/13 6:16 pm

Assuming @rlamds that you pay taxes and are not a bogart

rlands
07/02/13 6:20 pm

I know but I believe it's a societal duty to take care of those that are less fortunate. They are obviously having trouble finding a job. The amount of people who take advantage of the system is minuscule compared to the number of people helped by it

electricelise
07/02/13 6:22 pm

I agree that those types of programs do help people, but I don't believe that the govt should be handling it. The state and local governments should be handling it.

rlands
07/02/13 6:23 pm

But how would that really change anything?

electricelise
07/02/13 6:28 pm

It would change a lot bc the federal government would be less involved in our daily life. It might not seem like a big difference, but it really would make one. And also because the state or local gov would decide when to cut off certain programs...

electricelise
07/02/13 6:28 pm

Which would be a lot easier than for the fed gov to do.

rlands
07/02/13 6:33 pm

But then the state govt would just become like the federal govt...it would just be like we were a union of a bunch of smaller countries...

electricelise
07/02/13 6:36 pm

I guess, but I still don't agree that the federal gov should be able to have such programs. It is better to let the states decide amongst themselves if they want the programs or not

rlands
07/02/13 6:37 pm

Well, to each his own. I am just under the impression that the federal govt should control most things. Not all, of course, but most.

HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 6:53 pm

It does not take 2 years to find a job where you can at least get by. It might not be the kind of job you wanted, but you do what you can to make ends meet as independently as you can. But people don't do that because the government pays them better.

HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 6:56 pm

Strike that, the taxpayers are required to pay them better.

I am all for helping those in need who are trying to do what they can. I am sometimes overly compassionate.

But there are so many people who don't try to better themselves because it is

HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 6:56 pm

easier to have things given to them.

I'm sorry, I normally try to stay out of these conversations, but I couldn't this time. Haha

rlands
07/02/13 6:59 pm

Two years has been mentioned a couple of times. Where is that number coming from? I thought it was just over a year at maximum...and most people don't even get that.

HayleyS looking up.
07/02/13 7:01 pm

I did get the number from the people talking about it earlier in the conversation. I don't know the exact number off the bat.

What mostly gets under my skin are the people contently living off welfare and aren't making any effort to improve.

ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 7:02 pm

You're allowed up to 99 weeks, or 1.9 years of unemployment. And everyone gets that as a minimum, it's sickening.

rlands
07/02/13 7:08 pm

Scotty where are you getting that number from? And even if that's the maximum, there's no way most people take it for that long!

And hsim I totally understand where you're coming from. But I know that the number of people it does help makes up for

rlands
07/02/13 7:08 pm

the few people that do take advantage of the system.

rlands
07/02/13 8:02 pm

That was "during the unemployment crisis of 2007-2010".

anarchy GET OFF MY LAWN
07/02/13 2:50 pm

Hahaha. What's wrong with your mind?

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EarlyBird Portland
07/02/13 3:13 pm

⬆ This

susanr Colorado
07/02/13 2:48 pm

For that high a percent, I assume you're including things like Social Security and Medicare as "government aid." Is that correct?

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ScottyDoesNo Stand back and stand by
07/02/13 4:07 pm

Absolutely, the six largest government safety net programs: unemployment benefits, Social Security, Medicare, food stamps, Medicaid and welfare.

susanr Colorado
07/03/13 8:29 pm

Yeah, it's just temporary. Supposed to be a name change demo. I thought it would be over by now.

skinner Wisconsin
07/02/13 2:48 pm

Lol I like that

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XercesBlue ...
07/03/13 8:21 am

Until you actually think about it lol