Show of HandsShow of Hands

Cole12 August 13th, 2016 12:14am

Part 2: Kids...these things cost a lot of money! So, the US government provides the Child Tax Credit. If you have children, you can save up to $1,000 per child on your federal income tax bill. Support?

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knetzere Illinois
08/13/16 7:23 am

I don't like any form of deduction or credit

political Georgia
08/12/16 8:09 pm

Sounds good! People pay too much as it is.

08/12/16 6:57 pm

I don't believe you get that money back, it just comes off taxable income. Anyone?

DGroot America
08/12/16 7:27 pm

The child credit is one of the few things that is actually a credit. You pay $1000 les tax for each kid.

08/12/16 7:30 pm

Gotcha. Thanks for clarifying!

autumn2 California
08/12/16 6:55 pm

And support overpopulation? No thanks.

Casper Deep inthe Heart ofTexas
08/12/16 6:10 pm

Food cost money
Transportation costs money
Housing cost money.

The question is who's responsibility is it to pay for your stuff.

swervin Maryland
08/12/16 5:52 pm

I have a kid and I don't agree with this. You shouldn't get paid for having a kid...

RJ1969 SoCal
08/12/16 5:50 pm

Of all the things my tax dollars go to, this is at the bottom of my concerns list.

INWPatriot inland northwest
08/12/16 5:50 pm

They should charge more after the second child.

08/12/16 5:39 pm

Those who don't have children or those who can't have children shouldn't have to pay for those who do. I have seen a girl who wanted to have another baby so she could get more welfare. Don't encourage people to have more babies just to have more money. It's not fair to the kids.

spicysteve M14D SBS
08/12/16 5:27 pm

Comparing the cost of condoms to the cost of raising a child is positively ridiculous.

Axl752 NY
08/12/16 5:24 pm

Haha why are you so against the idea of people having kids? Live and let live.

Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:31 pm

My most deeply held belief is that procreation is unethical. I've been posting polls about antinatalism for a few years, so if you've been following me for a while, you've likely seen some of my arguments.

This poll series, however, isn't about antinatalism - it's about parental privilege.

wearemonkeys77 Lest We Forget... Hodor
08/12/16 5:32 pm

Limited resources And an increasing population equals guaranteed suffering and unrest.

Patriot77 Wyoming
08/12/16 5:32 pm

Nobody is against the idea of people having kids. We're just against the idea of people being forced to pay for other people's kids.

Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:36 pm

Well, I'm against people having kids...but again, that doesn't have anything to do with this poll.

Axl752 NY
08/12/16 5:37 pm

So you want this to be the last generation of humans, and when we all die then humanity dies?

Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:41 pm

I want no one to reproduce. If everyone immediately stopped reproducing, we would be the last generation, so yes, human extinction is one of the effects of what I want.

Axl752 NY
08/12/16 5:43 pm


Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:51 pm

There are many arguments. Here are my favorites:

1. There is an asymmetry - referred to as Benatar's asymmetry, after the South African philosopher David Benatar - between pleasure and pain. If X exists, pleasure is good, pain is bad. If X doesn't exist, the absence of pleasure is not bad, the absence of pain is good. Why is this axiomatically true? If there is a deserted island in the Atlantic, we don't mourn for the people who could have lived happy lives there. The absence of pleasure is not bad. More comprehensive explanation here ( and here (

2. Consent. People don't consent to being born. If I had been asked, I definitely wouldn't have consented to being forced into this hellhole. It's wrong to force bad things on people without their consent - and even if most people enjoy life, there are a bunch like me who don't. The people who....

Axl752 NY
08/12/16 5:54 pm

Ok. Here's a hypothetical. Would you vote for a bill that would require the termination of all humans under 2 years old?

Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:56 pm

enjoy life wouldn't be worse off if they were never born; the bunch who are like me would be better off if we were never born.

3. Duty. You have a duty to abstain from imposing pain on others; you have no concomitant duty to create pleasure for others. Carl comes up to Adam and tells him to punch Bill, a random stranger, in the face. If Adam punches Bill, Carl will give Bill a brand new car. Is it unethical for Adam to punch Bill without first getting Bill’s consent? Absolutely. Even though Bill will get a brand new car, you still need to ask for his consent first (this is the overlap with the consent argument) - for all we know, Bill could value his face more than the car.

Same with reproduction. Just because life contains certain pleasures doesn’t mean it’s A-OK to create suffering. It’s not. As a result, you have an ethical duty to refrain from reproducing.

Cole12 ...
08/12/16 5:57 pm

No. I don't support murder - I want humans to voluntarily choose to not reproduce.

knetzere Illinois
08/13/16 7:23 am

You can leave anytime you like. It's not hard.