Show of Hands

You pay to use the USPS and AMTRAK

USPS is received ZERO tax dollars for operations, as its funded through service revenues.
Amtrak does receive public funding for a portion of operations (track maintenance, use fees if owned by another party, etc), but it also is a corporation with stock sold on the private market.

Both are also service based organizations, where it requires a fee per use or it wouldn't be possible to maintain services (each individual could send a thousand packages a day of a fee wasn't in place)

Public Universities are government funded, and provide a societal benefit by improving our workforce and competitiveness in the world market.

MAKE SENSE?

College curriculums evolve to meet the needs of the changing environment and gives students better writing and analytical skills.

Also it's ridiculous to assume a liberal arts degree doesn't have real value.

Making college affordable does not mean removing all entrance standards or requirements to attend. It just means that it will be financially viable for those who college would be an appropriate choice.

Europe understood this a while ago, as well as understood many other things that we haven't comes to terms with....aka cost of healthcare

We pay taxes. *sigh*

We pay taxes. *sigh*

Oh good grief. Allow*. There*.

Let's hope @Abzzer learns to read and write so they too may have a chance to get into a school like Michigan.

I belive that's called Democrats and the SJW snowflakes they support so vociferously.

Charity, Financial aid, loans.

Yeah, but I understood the question to be should a family have to go into debt. There are a lot of families out there that live paycheck to paycheck. And if a charity was available great. It shouldn't take 20 years to pay off your education though. There should at least be no interest. If you have to go into debt.

I worked my way thru college -has that been outlawed or is that not even accepted anymore?
The choice is not debt or government subsidies. It is not a zero sum game.

Shiggy ... if the kid studies some nonsense like gender studies and only qualifies to work at McDonalds then they should expect to pay for 20 years.

You're suggesting that idiots should be able to go to any school and study whatever they want without consequences. That is simply not fair to them as it teaches them that they don't have to be accountable for their moronic decisions. Life just isn't that way!

Okay I don't think nonsense should be studied. And I don't have a hard stance on this issue. I do feel that everyone deserves a chance to have a good education. Not for clown college or anything. And I don't think most idiots have a desire to be more educated. Most idiots think they already know everything...

Shiggy ... I don't disagree that those who want it, should have a path to get it. I, for one, had nothing. I worked and went to school. I left school with a modest amount of debt, and given my good grades and engineering degree, I was able to get a great job and pay it off. I then spent a lifetime earning a good wage and committed to position my four kids FAR better off than I had it. They all did well.

Net ... if you're willing to work for it, making compromises along the way, the system is already set up where you can succeed!

Well I appreciate that we can have a discussion that stays on topic. And I do feel that even if you get help you should also be helping yourself whether it be having a job or working for the school or whatever. If a person doesn't have to work hard to get it they likely won't appreciate it. Just worry about the kids with no support from family and the ones that are the first in their families to go to college.

Shiggy ... those of us who had no support from family still made it! Yes, it was harder, but I value that experience as it made me stronger, and more committed to changing things for my kids.

I'm proud that my kids can now stand on my shoulders and reach even higher.

You sound like a string person and I'm happy that your kids have things easier than you did. That's what it's all about to me.

This user is currently being ignored

It's not free. We all pay taxes.

This user is currently being ignored

The gov't interference is contributing to the runaway costs.

I find it ironic that people support programs that do the exact opposite of what they claim to be doing

Hell yeah, good point.

Who said that you'd have to pay for it?

"they're not going to start giving me money from their paycheck every month to pay me back for the taxes I had to pay for them getting a free education." considering you solely will not be paying for someone's education via taxes, & that if the person is receiving a paycheck they'd also be paying taxes, I'm not sure exactly what your point was.

they should pay for their education solely not rely on any tax involvement. No one paid for mine, no one pay for my kids, I'm not willing to pay for anyone else's either.

Why

Why? Because you are responsible for your own life, not me and certainly not the gov't.

It got expensive because government got involved by providing cheap loans.

But the thing is, if the degree is worthwhile, no government subsidy is necessary. It's ok to take out loans for an engineering degree because those jobs pay well.

You're also assuming anybody can get student loans. Private student loans are just like any other loan. You have to have good credit or co-sign with a parent who has good credit.

Either way, do you really want college students starting out in life with a pile of debt?

This user is currently being ignored

You can't get a good job with just a high school degree anymore. I think that's reason enough to do something about affordability of college. Not saying anything about how to fix that, but you have to at least recognize it's a problem.

This user is currently being ignored

Not everyone is capable of doing manual labor type jobs like construction, which is one of the few trades that pay a living wage with a HS diploma anymore now that manufacturing is gone. Many of us are smart enough and would thrive in a highly skilled job but end up wasting these talents in service jobs because college is out of reach or that loan seems too risky.

Obviously some people do well with only a high school diploma, but you know you are an exception. You also know that you could not just go out and get any job you want.

Just assuming here, but I would guess that you would need some sort of training for construction. I never said you needed college, just more than a high school degree. Also, since you're management, I'm assuming you aren't straight out of high school.

This user is currently being ignored

Depends what type of education. I'm not so sure art majors are worth the $160,000 of classes.

Government-provided is not the only alternative.

Except for would you do your job for free? I might if I got room and board for myself and my family, 3 square meals and a discretionary budget, but then that would probably cost more than what I make anyway.

Our taxes already pay for the professors salaries. The worst part is that colleges like UC Berkeley for example are accepting way more out of state/country students for the higher tuition because the schools are already under funded.

The annual 70 billion dollars the federal government gives out for grants could go towards paying for everyone's college. That way the super poor don't get a free ride with grants while the middle class like always get stuck paying the burden

Oh I like the money for GPA thing. That's smart. And set classes up so people don't just take the easy ones to prop up their GPA.

True

You don't! Just wait until you can afford it or don't buy it at all.

You used to be able to do that. Not anymore. Do you know how much a university costs?

What year did you go to college idiot? 1980? When college was affordable right?

In TN, the first 2 years of community college are tuition free. If you can't live at home with mom and dad, you may need to work a full-time job and go to school part-time. It said a state school, not private.

So...you benefitted from two years of free education, and think that that is a bad thing?

Not me personally. I'm telling you what it is right now and explaining why going to college does not require taking out student loans. And I didn't even mention scholarships.

Yes, but not every college does that. That's just one place. Plus, you're kinda advocating a few years of free public college with this argument.

Don't go to a university if you can't afford it, or don't want to borrow money to pay for it.

With a mindset like yours, the one who called someone an idiot, you shouldn't be worrying about College.

I'm not advocating anything but the reality that it's possible to go to college without borrowing money, which was the original question. Every community college in TN is tuition free for 2 years if you maintain a 2.5 GPA. It's from lottery money. I voted against and don't play the lottery. It is what it is.

If anyone really wants to know, I went to a private university in the mid-90s. Half of it was paid for by money left to me by my grandfather. The rest was scholarships, my parents, and working part-time.

Tuition at MTSU this year is $8400, BTW. The largest college in TN.

I am not debating whether or not it is possible to go to college without incurring debt. Notice that the question was merely whether or not that should be the case at public institutions.

Why ask if what already is, should be? I don't know anyone that thinks college should be more expensive. The problem is that too many people believe it isn't currently possible and therefore campaign for more government subsidies.