Show of HandsShow of Hands

PamGH April 4th, 2016 1:03am

Data shows that the connection between vaccination and autism does not exist. There is not evidence to support such claims. Refusing to vaccinate children puts everyone at risk. Spread the word and stop this lunacy.

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thomas12266
04/04/16 1:55 pm

They have embryonic kidney cells in them from real babies or (EKC cells) and fibroblast lung tissue from the same source.

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thomas12266
04/04/16 1:53 pm

I am not. It's the truth.

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thomas12266
04/04/16 12:14 pm

I had a reaction to the MMR I. The MMR II, Varivax vaccine, and the Zostavax vaccines have real babies in them, so yes, I'm a firm believer that vaccination can cause autism.

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susanr Colorado
04/04/16 2:19 pm

No, vaccines do not "have real babies" in them. They don't even contain cells from "real babies" as you also state above.

Vaccines contain weakened virus or dead viral parts. To produce multiple copies of a virus, it has to be grown in some medium, and in the case of human viruses this sometimes means they are grown *in* compatible cells. *Human* cells. It's not very easy to get human cells to grow for very long in culture, except for a few kinds. Human fetal cells sometimes have that property.

Does this mean that "real babies" or even aborted fetal tissue are harvested all the time for growing vaccines? NO.

There are two cell lines - cells that have been in culture for *years*, dividing and dividing and dividing, so there are lots of them - that are used in producing some vaccines.

thomas12266
04/04/16 2:23 pm

These cell lines contain the DNA.
Look up HEK cells and vaccines. The shingles vaccine, rubella part of the MMR (measles, mumps, and rubella), and the rabies vaccine have these in it. Merck and related companies sell these vaccines to clinics anyway.

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 2:33 pm

One of those cell lines, WI-38, was derived from a 3-month fetus from a therapeutic abortion in 1962. The other, MRC-5, came from a 14-week fetus aborted in the UK in 1966. Both abortions would have been done regardless of any further use of the fetal tissue; it was simply used instead of being discarded, and the derived cell lines have been used a bazillion times since then.

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 2:37 pm

There may be extremely small amounts of DNA from the cells in some vaccines; they are not an integral part of the vaccine. And a FAR cry from the statement that vaccines contain human cells. Much less "real babies."

And there is NO proven connection between autism and vaccines. NONE.

In fact, it is now known that autism begins earlier than when vaccines are even given, further showing that there is no link at all.

thomas12266
04/04/16 2:37 pm

It was still the results of an abortion. The baby wasn't considered when they donated it's body which is wrong. Profit was on the scientists minds, not life.

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 2:42 pm

I'm aware of HEK-293 cells; they are widely used in research. (I used them once myself; not for anything related to vaccines, though; it was cancer research.) They were derived in the Netherlands in 1973, from a fetus that was legally aborted.

Okie1967 The world is crazy
04/04/16 2:50 pm

I agree the use of aborted cells for anything is just abominable. Just sick.

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 2:52 pm

If you think that profit is what drive scientists like Leonard Hayflick (I believe he was responsible for both cell lines I initially described above), you're quite wrong. He has made enormous contributions to many areas of human biology and medicine. He was born in 1928 and is still a professor of anatomy. I don't know if he has ever profited financially from any of his discoveries, but if he has, it was well deserved.

I invite you to learn more about this man in particular, and reconsider the accusation that profit was what was on his mind: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonard_Hayflick

Also consider that vaccine production has never been a very profitable industry, anyway, even for the scientists in that business.

thomas12266
04/04/16 2:57 pm

It wasn't him who developed those cell lines, it was Alex van der Ebb I believe.

thomas12266
04/04/16 3:04 pm

WI-38 was developed by him though. He needs to take the WI-38 lung fibroblasts cells off the market

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 3:05 pm

Van der Eb cultured the HEK 293 cells; they were transformed (modified so they would continue to grow in culture) by a graduate student in his lab. I was referring to the previous 2 cell lines I mentioned, regarding Hayflick.

I know nothing about either Van der Eb's or the other man's life. But I can tell you almost for sure from many years of personal experience in medical research that the kind of work they were doing was experimental basic research, and dollar signs were not predominant in their minds as they worked.

PamGH Washington
04/04/16 3:05 pm

Ok, I read that there is a casual relationship that needs more investigating, between the use of fungicides and autism. This is a much more likely, yet unproven, candidate. Put your energy into looking for the real cause is my advice.

thomas12266
04/04/16 3:07 pm

What would make a person use an innocent life for a vaccine. The end does not justify the means.

susanr Colorado
04/04/16 3:10 pm

Abortion is *legal.* Use of fetal tissue to save lives is better than discarding it.

I can understand not *wanting* abortion to be legal, but as long as it is, and as long as abortion is never done for research purposes (it simply isn't), it is *legal* to use fetal tissue for research.

Your complaint is about *abortion.* Work on changing *that.*

Okie1967 The world is crazy
04/04/16 9:54 am

I really don't think the anti-vax people subscribe to the autism argument anymore. That's been debunked. When the outbreak in LA county happened a couple of years ago and we learned that huge numbers of LA kids were unvaccinated, it turned-out that the ones not vaccinated were the children of affluent parents who held the "whole foods" mentality. The whole foods mentality is the uber health conscience mindset that says proper nutrition without additives, organic, etc, is all that's needed to be healthy.

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Okie1967 The world is crazy
04/04/16 9:56 am

These were well-to-do white people who live in good neighborhoods and eat organic food. These were nanny state liberals who didn't want a "poison" injected into their kids. Go do some research on it and you'll find the articles that were published about it in timeframe.

PamGH Washington
04/04/16 12:42 pm

Thank you😄

corino Utah
04/04/16 9:54 am

Studies show that facts rarely change people's opinions.

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PamGH Washington
04/04/16 10:58 am

Omg so true...but I keep trying🤓

4boot LaTrineodeur, MN
04/04/16 2:11 pm

...and sometimes "facts" are only disguised as such.

PamGH Washington
04/04/16 3:07 pm

Mark Twain said there are statistics and damned statistics. It pays to be educated in math because they are so slippery, if you get what I mean.

TopsQueen Oregon Coast
04/04/16 9:42 am

My grandson is autistic. My daughter-in-law didn't drink, smoke, or have coffee drinking and smoking she didn't do anyway. Sometimes bad things just happen. She counts yourself blessed because even though he's autistic he's a real cuddle bug

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CoffeeNow Powderpuff Leftist
04/04/16 8:45 am

Dank memes cause vaccines

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gow488 Wisconsin
04/03/16 8:59 pm

Anti-vaxxers are ridiculous. Vaccines should be mandatory.

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EmeraldShift Liberty, Justice For All
04/04/16 5:48 am

Mandatory for maybe school or even job attendance, but other than that, no.

DiQuellaPira
04/04/16 5:56 am

We prosecuted the Nazis at Nuremberg for for forcibly injecting prisoners......

WorstGooEver Nuke the Hurricanes
04/04/16 5:56 am

I know some are to go to school in my county.

MrsCrayonWax
04/04/16 6:19 am

So schools that require vaccinations are now Nazis?

DiQuellaPira
04/04/16 6:30 am

No....you don't have to send your kids to a public school....(you'd be doing them a favor)....its when you make the jump to mandatory vaccination( by using the police power of government) that you become a Nazi

CoffeeNow Powderpuff Leftist
04/04/16 8:45 am

"Anti-vaxxers are ridiculous."

Yes.

"Vaccines should be mandatory."

No.

susanr Colorado
04/03/16 6:15 pm

Some people have other concerns than autism, but I agree that there are really no medical issues to be concerned about, except obviously people who are allergic to components of some vaccines, or who cannot be vaccinated because of age of compromised immunity. All the more reason for as many other people to be vaccinated as possible, because they'll protect those folks through "herd immunity."

The vaccine-autism "link" has not just been debunked through good scientific investigation, but (as most hopefully know by now) it can almost entirely be attributed to one bad study with poor methodology and some faked data.

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susanr Colorado
04/03/16 8:55 pm

...because of age *or compromised immunity...

MrsCrayonWax
04/04/16 6:20 am

And Jenny McCarthy