Show of HandsShow of Hands

Cole12 December 11th, 2015 10:29pm

I'm very skeptical about the utility of many jobs today. The fact that people waste 40+ years of their lives pushing paper and doing other unnecessary things for companies (most of which only exist to sell useless crap) seems silly. Agree?

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ladyniner81 I hate people
12/13/15 9:34 am

I wish I could find a job you could work from home but most of them are scams.

sea California
12/12/15 3:36 pm

There are many jobs that are "worthless." It's impossible to make every job 100% value added every second of every day. It's just far more prevalent in government and union jobs because there is no incentive to reallocate those jobs that are "worthless."

PresWK Minnesota
12/12/15 9:46 am

It's not silly getting paid in cash

lcamino Florida and Georgia
12/11/15 8:57 pm

What is silly or useless to one person, may not be to another. There are many people who want and enjoy the kind of job you describe. Everyone is different. And I admire anyone for earning a living.

MisterE Conservistan
12/11/15 8:44 pm

Some jobs are bullshit, but there's also a lot of people who like what they do. I'll concede that a lot of people who are trying to fill a void in their life by buying things they don't need. I'm not totally convinced it's a systematic problem.

Brilliant10 Ioway
12/11/15 7:23 pm

Every job has a purpose

AnarchoComrade Anarchist Federation
12/11/15 7:10 pm

Sounds like you'd make a good commie 😉🏴

Look up libertarian socialism. You might like what you see

Cole12 ...
12/11/15 7:17 pm

I've been reading r/anarchism all afternoon, actually. That's what inspired the poll. I've read about libertarian socialism - I'm a huge Chomsky fan. I love how, more than individuals in any other ideology, how focused left anarchists are on hierarchy and oppression. Most people in the world today don't realize how much oppression is involved with race, gender, sex, nationality, and class. Whenever someone says America (or any other country) is equal, I want to slap them across the face.

My problem is, how do we know anarchism won't devolve into neo-feudalism?

AnarchoComrade Anarchist Federation
12/11/15 7:34 pm

I'm glad to hear this!
Now, please don't be turned off to the idea if I happen to give you a bad explanation. Please continue to read up on it and learn for yourself.
To answer your question, and it is a good question, I don't think that's possible with left anarchism. The very nature of it, federalism, confederalism, horizontal networking, Unionism (all in anarchist terms) would keep things politically decentralized and autonomous, while economically completely co-dependent and socially centralized.
With all of this, along with things like the Internet and the infrastructure we already have, I envision a society where personal liberty is maximized, order is near-perfected, and a sense of union is felt from all corners of the anarchist confederation.

Captainbstring Biden is a Clown
12/11/15 6:44 pm

It's called making a living. You have to do something that people will pay you for if you want to eat and have a roof over your head.

Carolynn new jersey
12/11/15 6:28 pm

I know exactly what you mean and I've had the same thoughts.

bunnymama5 NH
12/11/15 6:14 pm

Depends on type job selected...job satisfaction relies on your personal goals...what job makes you passionate about...medicine,teaching, business, technical, scientific, clerical, people centered, much money or other perks will do, so many factors to consider...Chose teaching and never regretted it...

Celadonne ballfield
12/11/15 5:49 pm

As always, I dig your challenging our capitalist society's "ideals"! It's healthy and imperative. It's what Marx and Lenin did, with the same healthy questions you're posing, and it's how socialism/communism were born. In such societies, tho, I've been told, some people won't contribute their fair share, leading to conflict, and greed and corruption would inevitably lead to collapse (although I believe this to be true of every economic structure). Yes, most jobs in capitalism are nothing more than part of a cycle of made-up "needs," with little or no meaning or contribution to REAL societal needs. That's capitalism, baby! BUT, you can find a way to make it work for you. If you find yourself stuck in accounting, then you can make it "good" by, for example, working for some green energy company or animal shelter, or by volunteering your services to those who can't afford it, or by offering your computer and typing skills to those without, or by tutoring to high school kids in math... :)

Celadonne ballfield
12/11/15 5:52 pm

Keep on asking these important questions, Cole. Read up on what's been done (Marxism, for example) and what has failed, what's succeeded, and why. Keep challenging, and keep thinking of ways to make it better. Without people like you, we'd all be lost!

Cole12 ...
12/11/15 6:21 pm

Thank you. :)

I'm not a Marxist or anything like that. My economic views are all over the place. What I am for sure, though, is a minimalist. And I also despise monotony. I think the mixed economy most western countries have now is a good option, but these are some of my grievances with it.

Celadonne ballfield
12/11/15 7:46 pm

Really? I think it's a terrible option. I don't dislike marxs views at all. He said it would leave more time for creativity.

Ebola1 Florida
12/12/15 12:35 am

And don't forget that Lenin murdered 18,000,000 people and Mao 70,000,000 for their Marxist and Communist Utopias respectively. The leftists of the world have done a lot of damage and been responsible for a tremendous amount of human suffering on a global basis.

Cole12 ...
12/12/15 12:39 am

That doesn't discredit their ideologies.

Cole12 ...
12/12/15 12:44 am

No, it doesn't. Just because certain socialists and communists committed horrible crimes, it doesn't mean that socialism and communism can't work at all.

Ebola1 Florida
12/12/15 12:53 am

Ideologies that can't stand w/o murdering tens of millions of people are not successful ideologies IMHO. Do you feel the same about about Nazi/Fascism? That is that those ideologies could still work in some circumstances? Certainly the atrocities committed by the Nazis (who only killed about 11,000,000) pale in comparison to those created in the name of communism and Marxism.

klmmcm13 Massachusetts
12/11/15 5:41 pm

I recently retired. Well, more accurately I was retired. It was suggested that perhaps I should retire when I broke a hip and went out on disability. I didn't want to but figured it was in the best interest of the company. I worked there for 17 years and in fact am a minority owner. I could have protested. But since it was a majority owner making the recommendation I didn't figure a fight was worth it. I absolutely do feel that I wasted slot of time and effort.

HayleyS looking up.
12/11/15 4:58 pm

I used to think so until I worked in an office.

At least at the company we work for, all paper work we do is done for a reason. And if it could be optimized, it only hasn't because we don't really have enough time to figure out how.

HayleyS looking up.
12/11/15 5:00 pm

We are an industrial lighting warehouse that sells a significant amount of lights mostly to other businesses in the city.

I remember thinking that there couldn't possibly be enough paper work for 5 people to work 40 hours a week, just in the office.
But believe me, there is. And it's all important because you have to be super careful when you're dealing with so much money.

Our filing system could be updated, but nobody has time to deal with it.

Axl752 NY
12/11/15 3:53 pm

I see your point. It's an unnatural way to live, probably why depression is so prevalent in modern society.

Ebola1 Florida
12/11/15 3:44 pm

Living at home and having your every need met I guess you can afford to be skeptical. Ask again when you grow up.

Cole12 ...
12/11/15 3:52 pm

Ebola, I don't live at home, and you didn't answer my question. You seem to have trouble understanding a lot of things, so I'll rephrase my question for you: Do you agree that many jobs are unnecessary and contribute nothing to society?

Ebola1 Florida
12/11/15 3:59 pm

Where do you live Cole? Do you pay your own way? What kind of job do you have? There are many jobs and people that contribute nothing to society. You might want to look in the mirror and decide if you are one.

Cole12 ...
12/11/15 4:06 pm

You're still avoiding my question. I'm not sure why I've become the target of your hostility - this is an unbiased poll. Let me try one more time. Company A makes a widget. It's a cheap piece of crap that benefits no one. Bob works for this company in a low level sales position or something like that. Bob's job could probably be absorbed by someone else at the company, but management's unmotivated to make any changes. Does Bob's job seem silly to you?

Ebola1 Florida
12/11/15 5:12 pm

Depends. Is he supporting a family, does he have to pay bills? In almost every scenario I can imagine other than if he is just working for fun I would say no the job is not silly.

Vietman manhattan
12/12/15 3:13 am

If someone is purchasing the product than someone thinks it's worthwhile. Not to mention all the people said business supports. Not everyone can make the history book cole.

12/11/15 3:40 pm

In the grand scheme of things, yes.

blitz6799 Chicagoland
12/11/15 3:37 pm

I wish I could see a world where they didn't invent currency. What kind of art, music, and philosophy would we have? Also, what negatives would we see that we don't have now? Someone really needs to figure out interdimensional travel!