Show of HandsShow of Hands

Mattwall1 July 31st, 2015 6:12pm

The US is still fighting the Civil War. This won't end until supporters of the losing side admit defeat-but that admission requires an understanding of why their pet side fought, the consequences had they won, & a repudiation of treasonous symbols.

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Brilliant10 Ioway
08/04/15 7:40 am

Well then we're still fighting every war because there is always somebody somewhere who still isn't happy with the results of every war and hasn't admitted defeat

dessy Indiana cornfield
08/01/15 12:08 pm

In ideology, yes it's still going on. But in reality it goes far back to the foundings of this country.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:32 am

I agree roots of it go that far back. But the the language and symbology used is more linked to the Civil War than the founding (IMO at least)

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:35 am

On the grounds of what, exactly?

musiman28 Cotton country
08/02/15 1:54 pm

Because it is. I'm not going to argue with you. It's pointless.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 3:22 pm

I'll just leave it at this then: if you claim something is BS, an answer beyond "because it is" is necessary to answer why and make clear the reason for calling it BS has any standing

musiman28 Cotton country
08/02/15 5:51 pm

Matt, like I said, arguing with you is pointless. I don't care what you think of my not doing it, but I just don't want to deal with it.

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/01/15 7:41 am

Shut the fuck up mattwall

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SouthernLaw Old North State
08/01/15 7:43 am

You're definitely losing at least one follow bc of this stupid poll

LostTexan42 Deal With It
08/02/15 8:23 am

What a reasonable, well thought out rebuttal.

LostTexan42 Deal With It
08/02/15 8:26 am

I'll follow you mattwall, to make up for potty mouth here.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:33 am

You can follow or unfollow for any reason. Demanding I shut up because I post a poll you disagree with says more abut you (and possibly your position) than myself and mine

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 8:43 am

I post polls that are unbiased, no matter what my stance is, and I think u should do the same. Biased polls like yours ruin this app.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:49 am

Forgive me my good sir, but most users would say the majority of my pools do fall into the unbiased category. If, in just under 3200 poll, some have biases, I'm sorry. I'm not about to claim to be perfect, but I am going to say your claim is baseless

Hooah Fmr. Zia
08/01/15 7:39 am

The war is fucking over.

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chrismisen atlanta
07/31/15 11:26 pm

no, i disagree. pretty much all confederate flag wavers are nationalist to a fault, and will defend the country to the death. if we were still fighting the civil war, they would be the exact opposite

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Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:30 am

They're so nationalistic they fly flags of a treasonous rebellion? Do you not see the irony and frankly, the utter contradiction inherent in that statement?

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 8:35 am

U obviously have never been to the South mattwall

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:38 am

Your best argument isn't to address the fact that people are claiming to be nationalists while flying flying flags of treason, but to ignore that completely? Yeah, maybe you should look at your own position before sidestepping the issue when it is

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 8:42 am

I find very much pride in both my country and the Confederate flag. Some people just don't understand what it means for us, and thats okay. But don't tell me I'm a treasonous person just because I find pride in my heritage.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:50 am

It's treasonous because it's a flag (assuming we are actually talking about the battle flag), representing a principle army in a treasonous rebellion against the United States. How much pride you have is irrelevant to its status as a sign of treason,

Mattwall1
08/02/15 8:52 am

And claiming to have any patriotism or nationalism while flying that makes about as much sense as Scottish Nationalist claiming to want an independent Scotland while also claiming to be a British patriot-except they have the intelligence not to

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 8:59 am

Do NOT tell me I don't have nationalism. You don't know me. My family has extensive military history in serving our country and I am very proud of my country.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 9:07 am

And all of that is moot with support of treason. You want to be a true nationalist? Stop flying confederate flags and other symbols. At that point, you're fine. But claiming to be a nationalist makes no sense when supporting treason against the

Mattwall1
08/02/15 9:08 am

Country you're claiming to have nationalism for. This is a difficult concept.

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 9:10 am

That flag for most southerners doesn't stand for treason. Once you can get that through your thick skull you'll be ok.

Mattwall1
08/02/15 9:33 am

Not doesn't really matter if they think that flag stood for chicken wings and sweet tea, sectional pride, or anything else. The flag is a flag of treason. If you can't get that through your thick skull, don't claim to be anything but pro treason

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 9:37 am

I'm not gonna try this with you anymore. I guess you'll never understand.

Albort Capitalist Anarchy
07/31/15 11:04 pm

It really disappoints when I think I'm following a knowledgeable user, but find out they are really confused on an issue as such.

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blitz6799 Chicagoland
07/31/15 7:31 pm

Makes me wonder, as we become more interconnected will these battles eventually resolve at a faster pace, or will it instead elongate them?

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DeanGandley New York
07/31/15 6:57 pm

By that logic the crusades are still going on.

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LochnessMonster Milky way
07/31/15 5:55 pm

Matt I'm sorry but are you stupid? There's no fight. People need to drop this bull crap already. We are all sick of hearing it. Have a good day.

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Mattwall1
07/31/15 7:25 pm

The only bullcrap is that confederate sympathizers have spent a century and a half twisting history, refusing to admit the cause of the rebellion, refusing to admit its treasonous nature, admiring confederate symbols, refusing to admit what the

Mattwall1
07/31/15 7:26 pm

Ramifications of a confederate victory would have been, and then acting like the North is evil when we point out the stupidity, treasonous nature, and vile nature of the rebellion in question. The maxim is supposed to be Vae Victis, not Var

Mattwall1
07/31/15 7:27 pm

Triumphatori. However, to answer the first question, no, I am not stupid. I've been known to have some abnormal opinions, but stupid is not an accurate descriptor

SouthernLaw Old North State
08/02/15 8:36 am

Its people like me that will be saving our nation from people like mattwall

LostTexan42 Deal With It
08/02/15 9:04 am

How are you going to "save" this nation? One example of something you've done thus far please?

Arkansas123 Neoconservative
07/31/15 3:49 pm

So you'd like to destroy and suppress scholarship that opposes your favored view?

Sounds like the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany.

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Mattwall1
07/31/15 4:39 pm

Nice try Ark-no one is taking away their right to their views, or saying they shouldn't have the right to them. That doesn't change the reality that unless what was brought up in the poll happens, the civil war won't truly be over.

Zod Above Pugetropolis
07/31/15 1:38 pm

Which is what should have happened almost a century and a half ago when the insurrection was put down.

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Mattwall1
07/31/15 3:07 pm

Yep, but alas...

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:54 am

Officially. Unofficially...

makem Chinese Xinjiang Camp
07/31/15 12:27 pm

So then you'd agree that the crusades are ongoing? That is the kind of logic I'm getting from you. Not trying to criticize, just clarify.

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
07/31/15 1:00 pm

This user is currently being ignored

Mattwall1
07/31/15 1:12 pm

Makem-one could make that argument, but Christian-Islamic relations have expanded beyond the Crusades, though extremists on both sides still seem to want to fight it. North-South relations are more broadly effected by the civil war, and still tend to

Mattwall1
07/31/15 1:13 pm

Revolve around them in a way Christian-Islamic relations and the crusades generally don't

Mattwall1
07/31/15 1:14 pm

Nema-I'd wonder why you're doing it, but given the history of the Templars, one could claim that (they could also claim they were more tolerant of Muslims than other Christians at the time)

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
07/31/15 1:18 pm

This user is currently being ignored

Mattwall1
07/31/15 1:21 pm

Nema-the former is a possibility, but your original question did not list that, hence why I didn't address it. I think we both know the second example is both inaccurate and a false analogy

Nemacyst No Lives Matter
07/31/15 1:35 pm

This user is currently being ignored

makem Chinese Xinjiang Camp
07/31/15 1:46 pm

Matt - I think I understand what you're saying.

GrandmaALiCE
07/31/15 11:28 am

Disagree. A war ends when the governments or nations reach an agreement or active fighting stops. It does not require agreement or understanding by all civilians on either side. That is desirable, of course, but not a requirement.

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Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:48 am

Officially. It does not prevent its participants from attempting to live out that war beyond the official peace. In many ways, Spain has this phenomenon, in that the left refuses to admit any wrongs-and the right tries to simultaneously pretend that

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:49 am

Franco was evil while doing everything short of declaring him an official demigod. Neither side there is willing to admit the historical realities, and thus cannot come to any understanding to move on, though the Spanish left does accept the lack of

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:51 am

A republic. Here, we may no longer dress in blue and gray and fight on the battlefield-but the fight did not truly end at Appomattox or Palmito Ranch-or behind closed doors as the election of 1876 essentially put the death knell to reconstruction.

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:52 am

Significant parts of the nation still hold the so called Confederacy as an honorable and legitimate cause, refuse to acknowledge why they fought (which even their own leaders did), refuse to acknowledge the consequences of a confederate victory (both

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:54 am

Domestically and internationally), still cannot acknowledge that the actions for the bill of treason (whether or not they'd want to support it after, they can't make the admission in the first place), and still honor the symbols of the so called

Mattwall1
07/31/15 11:56 am

Confederacy. And while most wars, especially civil wars, follow the principle of Vae Victis. The U.S. Civil War is one of the few where that maxim was flipped and became Vae Triumphatori

bringstheeagle Colorado
07/31/15 10:43 pm

Amen and well said. I'm just gushing over here. Lol.