Show of Hands

Was it a different time, or just different reporting systems? In the early 80s local law enforcement was responsible for the missing children in their jurisdiction. This probably meant a not-to-sophisticated database and little collaboration with

Other law enforcement. I guess the question is, were the systems that we have now put in place because of an increasingly dangerous world, or was the world always dangerous, and the systems just clue us in on just how dangerous it is?

I roamed when I was 10, as did my brother and my sisters...

This is my daughter (except for the tattoo). She is a mentally disabled adult of 22. She is not capable of always understanding the results of her choices based on seemingly (to us) simple and normal desires and decisions. That is why before she...

...turned 18, we became her legal guardians (a sobering process) which removed her right to make those & other contract/agreement decisions without our consent. Credit cards, leases/rent, contracts all have to go through us. Paying for a face tattoo

...falls within that restriction. Unfortunate that the Tattoo can't be easily removed, I want the money back and will take to court for additional damages. If possible to remove, they will pay for that as well. The mentally disabled have rights.

I was in the same situation with my brother, mentally 7-10 yr old. He lived with me until he passed last year (@30yrs). People are horrible, taking advantage...
I get so upset all these comments, people that have not been there don't understand
:-(

So very sad for your loss. I cannot imagine our lives without my daughter & all the wonderful times, frustrating challenges & the enrichment she brings to our lives! I sense most of the commenters here have not walked the walk.

I pray all the great memories you have of your brother bring joy and peace to your life.

Thank you SD, I miss him every day. It was hard like losing a brother, son and friend all at the same time.

SD and Nik, y'all are wonderful and I wish everyone with special needs had people in their lives who look out for them. I'm a special ed teacher, and my first thought with this scenario was of some of my students who will face this later in life.

PartyFree, I agree 100%

It's not their decision. Laws already exist to protect the mentally disabled. Especially if they are wards of a guardian.

So mentally challenged adults shouldn't be allowed to get tattoos?

If a 10 year old is not considered competent to make that decision, then someone with the mental capacity of a 10 year old is also not able to make that decision.

So your saying the mentally impaired can't have the same rights as other adults. A 10 year old can't get married but a mentally handicapped person can. So where's the logic?

A 10 year old can't legally drive but a mentally handicap adult can as long as they pass the test....

The mentally disabled need a clear thinking capable adult to make or assist in making life decisions. It is a process, but they are capable. My daughter can safely walk to the corner store and purchase drinks and snacks and get home. But we had to

...go with her the first 10 times, then watch anonymously from a distance before we let her do it alone. Driving? No way. Public transportation? Maybe, in time.

I don't think that their rights outweigh concerns for their own safety, as well as that of others. There are a reason that 10 year olds cannot get a driver's license. This has to do with brain development, ability to make judgements, and to reason.

The ultimate question how on earth is any of this the responsibility of the tattoo artist? It's not always easy to judge the exact level of a person's mental abilities. For all they knew this person is capable of making this choice.

It is the tattoo artist's responsibility because the mental impairment was obvious.To permanently tattoo a turtle on the face of a mentally challenged person is immoral.How sick to make her life even more difficult, for the "artist's" selfish reason.

The tattooist in this hypothetical scenario has a service they provide. She went to them and requested said services. It's her caretakers responsibility to know where she's at and what she's doing period.

That's true. But the face is far from an "ordinary" place to apply a tattoo. Some level of discretion by the artist would be in order. 24 hour waiting period, you can't do this alone - bring a family member, are you sure you want to do this would be

appropriate comments in this situation.

Would anyone that asks for a face tattoo be demonstrating a lack of judgement?

I would think so.

But the person does have to be 18 and that's because 18 year old are assumed to have the decision making skills to handle that kind of decision while a 10 year old does not

A mentally handicapped person cannot consent or have alcohol so yeah they can't get a tattoo

They can legally drive, and get married...I don't know of any laws where it's illegal to serve them alcohol....why can they get married but not get ink?

The mentally handicapped can do that but the mentally handicapped covers a broad range of people

If this person has been deemed capable of walking around alone with money then clearly their caretakers think they can handle the responsibility.

If your 10 year old got a tattoo would you be pissed at the artist?

My 10 year old doesn't have a valid ID stating they are 18 or older nor would they have that kind of money on them...

But let's say the artist didn't care that he had no idea and he had saved up $100

It is not discrimination. It is protecting people who are not capable of critical judgement making, or of determining consequences of their actions. The protection is from people who would take advantage of them, and from their own limitations.

If the tattoo artist didn't care about a 10 yr olds lack of ID they'd lose their license. However this individual was of age and had proof. Why should the tattoo artist be responsible for the care takers job?

Because they are a decent human being who does not take advantage of someone with an obvious mental handicap???

Furthermore if this individual is functioning enough to walk around town alone then they and their care takers have to take some responsibility.

parents? If you see a lost kid do you just walk the other way? We should care and take care of our brothers and sisters.

I shake my head in disgust!

I agree. I don't know if it is illegal to give the tattoo or not, but I believe that it immoral .

It was literally a coin toss between dove on the neck and turtle on the face

knowyourmeme.com/memes/i-like-turtles

Same situation but she walks in drooling with bib, diaper, childish Barbie doll, and helmet on. As the tattoo artist would you accept the client.

Had the question lined about that, which way we would vote on discrimination if she was refused. But it was looking like the vast majority is voting no

Omg record the date and time Chimama and I agree for once. If the person was capable of reading and signing the consent forms I would.

If the mentally disabled girl is the ward of a Legal Guardian, by law she is incapable of signing a binding agreement with out the consent of the guardian. We are in this situation with our daughter (22) and I would definitely exercise our rights

...to get a refund, and sue him to pay for the removal, and punitive damages.

So what you're saying is that care takers have ZERO responsibility here. Where were they when she was getting tatted up? Why do they allow her to carry such large sums of money? Seems pretty irresponsible on their end.

Any self respecting tattoo shop refuses to tattoo drunks.

Considering how many drunk tattoos actually get made, I'd say there are not very many "self-respecting" tattoos artists. Business is business, so it's not really fair to question someone's livelihood

And what if she doesn't have a case worker?

If anything perhaps there should be a tattoo waiting period implemented where you would have to express interest in getting a tattoo, state a planned location, and then have to wait at least 24 hours or maybe a week to get it.

I think a waiting period would be insane. A valid ID and a signed consent form stating you're not under the influence of drugs or alcohol is what's required in my state and personally I think that's enough.

For starters, she went to him asking for the nickel. He wasn't preying on her or trying to trick her, and he is not responsible for others stupid decisions. Just as a liquor store is not responsible for drunk drivers, the artist is not responsible.

Hopefully she likes turtles.

It's not the job of the tattoo artist to determine who is intelligent enough to get a tattoo and who isn't. It's the care takers fault if anyone's.

The tattoo artist took advantage of the girl, where is the outrage to that?
It was stated that she was obviously impaired.

She's legally an adult. Adults can get tattoos. If her care takers have issue with this then they need to do their job and watch her.

Hypothetical.

Sorry, all hypothetical, I use to put that but it ate up too many characters

Exactly what I was going to say

Exactly. My 10 year old isn't ever anywhere this could happen, nor would I trust him with more than 20.00 at any one time. Negligence of the parents/ guardians if you ask me.

Retarded, you mean mentally handicapped. Retarded is somebody who listens to MS NBC or Fox

The actual PC term is " functioning in the moderate range of intellectual disability" or "developmentally disabled."

In terms of which news you follow, if you believe any of the news sources, your judgement is questionable.

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Retarded, you mean mentally handicapped. Retarded is somebody who listens to MS NBC or Fox😈😎

Breck is right. The artist knew or should have known that she did not have the capacity to consent to something like that. Given that, it's an intentional tort.

Sorry for not being PC statesman. I'm old. My business law class books stated it that way. They may still say that. I have to catch myself. I still want to use old terms like negro. No harm intended. It was PC then.

I'm sorry. I was not trying to correct you at all. I'm just going based on what I've read recently and I'm not even starting law school until September so I'm sure you know much more than I do.

No Tierra. That was for statesman. Have fun in law school. My degree is in aviation management. The business law class was one of the best classes I ever had. It should be required for everyone in high school before you turn 18.

Breck1011, I agree on the business law class. We had 2 different one I high school. Learn a lot, most useful classes from high school. Our degree is in aviation management. Did you go to UND for it?

Breck1011, I too use to use retarded but my wife is a special Ed teacher and my son is a Special Ed teacher for artistic middle- high school teacher. So I got corrected a lot and still do from time to time. 😎😇

It would be the same as giving a tattoo to a minor.

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Exactly nemy. She should have constant supervision.

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How old is old enough to go to the park without a parent?

15-16 years old for me. And the artist should have to pay knowing she was mentality challenged. The 22year old girl was still considered a minor by doctors.

Holy moly, I can just picture all the crap a 14 year old would receive for not being able to go to the park without a parent. I'm so glad I didn't have to go through that.

"Sorry guys, I can't go without my mom" poor kid

What about a 12 year old? Would you let your 12-13 year old daughter go to the park alone? Even a 14 year old daughter? At least by 15-16 they will have a better understanding of what to watch out for for their safety and well being.

I don't know of many 12-14 year old kids with enough sence to not get into trouble or not pay attention to their surroundings to be left alone at a park or a movie theater or mall.

It wouldn't have to be me going. As long as there's adult supervision by one of the parents or my child or the other children my child is going with.

Of course I would let the kid go, in fact, I do now. And whenever I drive by the park, I see all their friends and not one parent

Nemacyst, Hear, Hear, great point. Where is the responsibility of the parent in this matter.

Justbob, "How old is old enough to go to the park without a parent?" There may not be any age limit on somebody who's mentally handicapped. Her parents are responsible for her well-being. Their lack of oversight should be considered in this matter😈

That's my point exactly. I am responsible for my children and if I'm not there or making sure another parent is there how am I being responsible and making sure my child is safe? Doing that is called child endangerment.

Justbob,"Of course I would let the kid go, in fact, I do now. And whenever I drive by the park, I see all their friends and not one parent." Are all these kids mentally handicapped? Justbob, I think you are missing that point, mentally handicapped.😈

Lochnessmonster, "If there is a obvious sign that she was mentally challenged then yes he should have to pay." I'm questioning the statement that you made. Tattoos are not cheap she had the money to pay for it, you'd be less likely to question it.😈

What if she went though her parent purse and wallet and stole the money from them? And no its almost always obvious if someone is challenged. And in the question she was obviously challenged and the artist knew it.

The other issue is the money. I can see an argument for allowing a 10 yo to go to the park with limited supervision, but who gives a 10yo enough cash for a tattoo?

I've seen people give tattoos for as little as 20$. You get what you pay for.

I will readily admit that I have very limited experience with anything tattoo related. I defer to the Lochness.

I tried to make it clear that he did know that she was mentally challenged.

Ok. Hmm... I guess I would still say it's the parents' responsibility for leaving her alone and not checking on her.

"Sometimes it isn't always obvious."

The poll actually says it is obvious in this case.

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