Show of HandsShow of Hands

Congressman February 3rd, 2014 2:28pm

Spanish legislatures are working on a bill that, if passed, would make abortion in Spain illegal except in cases of rape or jeopardy to the mother's help. Would you support or oppose a similar federal law in the Unites States?

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singkitty In the cloud
02/04/14 2:06 pm

Completely oppose it. No one should force to a woman to have a baby. It's not a choice I would make for myself, but I can't impose my personal morals on others.

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camigirl
02/03/14 11:18 am

Definitely, completely oppose.

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BeachSt Coastal Virginia
02/03/14 10:14 am

Quite ridiculous. Who saw the pictures of the protest crowd? It was impressive.

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Diknak Ohio
02/03/14 9:11 am

no way! Can you imagine the number of fake rape claims that will be filed? Girl has a one night stand, claims rape, gets an abortion, and guy goes to jail. Absolutely trash legislation with enormous consequences.

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aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 9:59 am

Haha. That's hilarious given our rape stats. More likely it's be very difficult to get an abortion via proving rape. See my convo with kscott below.

camigirl
02/03/14 11:16 am

Exactly what aj said. But man, how crazy the first thing you thing about is the guy. Hmm...

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 12:09 pm

Comes from living in a culture where we hear about how the poor accused's life is ruined in the media (Steubenville as an example) rather than any mention of how hard life is afterwards for a rape victim.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 12:10 pm

Also @diknak- something to think about: even though as a man your chances of being raped are much smaller than for a woman, you are still much more likely to be raped than falsely accused of it.

Diknak Ohio
02/03/14 2:16 pm

Of course the first thought I had was of a guy, because I am a guy. That's not some crazy notion, but it also most certainly would water down the real rape victims.

Diknak Ohio
02/03/14 2:17 pm

Yes, I am more likely to get raped than falsely accused, but I don't think that would remain true if the ability to get an abortion was tied to a rape claim. Don't assume just because I am a guy that I am OK with how rape victims are treated.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/05/14 8:08 am

I'm not assuming you're okay with it, I'm assuming you don't know a lot about it by your statement that false rape claims would skyrocket and be accepted. We're not even at a point where we can accept it with a video (Steubenville) so I don't know

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/05/14 8:08 am

You figure that would change so radically.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:16 am

Huge problem here: considering ~3% of rapists see a day in jail, how would we ensure a woman who was raped could access abortion, "prove" she was raped? It would require even more violation than she already feels. How where do we draw the life of the

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aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:18 am

Mother line? 80% chance of dying? 90? Over 50%? The government would decide how much of her life a woman would risk giving birth. Absolutely not. I'd never support a problematic law like this.

SmileyMoM Lab Rat Vampire
02/03/14 7:42 am

A woman's right of choice is very important to me.

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kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 8:27 am

They have the right to multiple choices prior to intercourse and even one after it to prevent a pregnancy.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:44 am

Yeah, listen to Scott, he's a man so is the authority on what we should get choices about, he knows how easy it is to get plan b, especially since pharmacists can refuse to sell it. /s

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 8:51 am

Federal courts ruled last year that Plan B was to be made OTC.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 9:53 am

Many stores have yet to comply. With time, my hope is that they do. This part of it varies depending where you are.

DeusOrbus Stay Positive
02/03/14 7:42 am

Oppose. Oppose it so hard and fast.

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kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 7:40 am

As a starting point, yes. Rape is a poor excuse considering there is the morning after pill.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:20 am

What if it doesn't work? Chances aren't 100%. What if a rape victim is held against her will and doesn't escape within the window plan B works? What if a child is raped who has hit puberty and she has no way to access it?

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:20 am

Also "rape is a poor excuse"? Seriously? I'm sure if you're ever raped in your lifetime you'll change your mind on that phrase.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 8:25 am

How many "what ifs" that you just described actually happen? 1 in 5 million? Maybe less than that?
I'm a guy so if I were raped I couldn't get pregnant. R

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:34 am

They do happen. Are you saying that if the rate is low those girls and women should be forced to give birth to a rapists child? And I realize you wouldn't get pregnant- but you'd likely empathize a bit more.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 8:45 am

I think they should give birth, yes, but you'll see from my OP that I'd support the proposed legislation of banning abortion for all except in case of risk of life to mother (also incredibly small) and rape victims.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:50 am

See my post above, proving rape would not be easy. Most rapists are never prosecuted and a small fraction are convicted.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:50 am

And as a rape survivor, I'm glad you can see why that should be left to the individual.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 8:55 am

The lack of prosecutions go both ways. There are many women that make false accusations because the man cheats on them or leaves them for another woman or any list of reasons.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:59 am

Not nearly as many as rapists who go free. That truly is a small percentage. Fun fact: this is because if you attempt to report and prosecute a rape you will be dragged through the mud. I know. I was told they could only prove consensual sex, despite

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 8:59 am

Injuries. They are nowhere near on the same scale.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 9:05 am

I don't see anyway of proving what the percentages are for real rapes vs false accusations. A woman could cause injury to herself to fake it too. I'm not saying that's the situation in your case, just that it could easily happen.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 9:55 am

Your logic is exactly why my rapist is still free. I'm sure it happens, but lets think about this: what incentives are there given how difficult rape is to prosecute? And false accusations account for 2-8% of rapes, these estimates include cases

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 9:56 am

A victim withdrew an accusation (not necessarily because she was lying, rape trials are traumatic for victims) so is on the high side if anything.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 9:58 am

Also, here in Madison, we had a woman who was gang raped on campus. She had vaginal and cervical lacerations (meaning big cuts) and it was still ruled consensual sex, DA wouldn't prosecute. Do you seriously think people injure themselves like that?

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 10:05 am

No I certainly don't think all rapes are faked or false accusations. That would be incredibly stupid to think. Do I think a woman could fake big injuries? Yes. In the case you mentioned? No.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 10:07 am

Thanks for considering the point. Of course injuries can be faked, but we need to look at the odds of that vs real injury. As of right now, the scales are tipped much too far in the faking direction and many rapists are free as a result.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 10:32 am

Well one thing I agree with you is that not enough true rapists are prosecuted or receive harsh enough sentences.

aj1545 Cat Lady
02/03/14 10:39 am

It's true. And most rapists are repeat offenders, so you have to send relatively few rapists to jail to spare relatively many victims from being raped, many more victims than rapists exist. Slightly better prosecution would bring numbers way down.

kscott516 Show Time
02/03/14 10:47 am

Yes, agreed.

MrLucchese If curious, ask.
02/03/14 7:32 am

I would be completely opposed.

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Statek Im from the Internet
02/03/14 7:29 am

Would you support or oppose this? Yes

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Statek Im from the Internet
02/03/14 7:32 am

But yeah, I'm assuming "No" is opposing