Show of Hands

Yo can either refer to a service provided by others as a right, or you can oppose slavery. But you can’t do both.

Healthcare isn’t a human right

Healthcare is a moral obligation for any country wealthy enough to afford it.

Most wealthy nations have made the morally correct decision to provide a universal health system for their citizens.

The United States is wealthier than all of those countries and yet they have chosen to provide tax breaks for their wealthiest citizens rather than healthcare for their poor and middle class citizens.

Right to a fair trial requires judges and lawyers.

Right to vote requires election workers

Right to free speech requires courts to protect it.

Teachers must be slaves because students have a right to education.

Firefighters are slaves because people have a right to emergency responses.

Nothing is a right that has to be provided by someone else. I’ll leave it to you to guess why.

Yes. It is a right. Calling that idea slavery is ludicrous. A doctor:

Chose to become a doctor

Is free to stop being a doctor


Is well paid for their service.



This whole “slavery” comparison is an incredibly stupid point people keep trying to make despite it making zero sense.

Absolutely not! My opinion is if you want insurance go buy it, if you don’t or can’t afford it then you don’t. You would just have to make payments like I did for way over half of my life. I would never expect everybody else to pay for my health problems. 🥰

You should have the right to get healthcare from an unlicensed source. You should have the right to import medications from other countries. You should have the right to practice medicine without a license.

These would all make healthcare cheaper.

Odysseyus the wealthy already pay a majority of their taxes, but apparently they don't in the fantasy you live in. Stop pretending like its not incompetent voters like yourself and politicians catering to people like you, that created the problem.

It's quite worrying that you would rather have more government involvement, which is what got us into the mess in the first place, instead of advocating for things like deregulation, more insurance options, not forcing drug companies to spend billions to get minor things approved, and getting rid of the government created shortage of doctors and healthcare workers.

No. It is not a right.

You have a right to a fair trial which requires judges and courts.

Teachers must be slaves because kids have a right to an education too. lol such a stupid take 😆

Absolutely NOT ! People need to work to live ! It’s not up to others to pay for other people medical just because of laziness !

Slaves?! They chose their profession, freely.

I don’t remember ever seeing healthcare in the Bill Of Rights. 🤔

Very simplistic view. But, with MAGA many things are simplistic with all the consequences and repercussions ignored.😵‍💫

Healthcare as a Public Good.....
No Upfront Fees: Similar to how citizens do not pay for individual police or fire responses, this model suggests healthcare should be funded through taxes rather than direct billing.
Universal Access: The goal is to provide coverage to everyone, treating health as a basic human right rather than a commodity, which could reduce medical bankruptcies.
Administrative Simplicity: By replacing multiple private insurance companies with a single public payer, administrative costs are reduced.
Focus on Prevention: A public system can prioritize preventive care, which can be more cost-effective in the long run than treating advanced illness.

We have double to triple the obesity rate of most first world countries, by far the highest opioid use, above average alcohol abuse, the highest traffic injury and death rate of any first world country. Of course our medical expenses are going to be high. Then add a severe doctor and medical provider shortage caused by the government, the US healthcare system essentially both paying for and subsidizing all medical indication for the rest of the world, extreme regulations on essentially all treatments and medical advances, plus the government subsidizing most necessary medical treatments.

And your solution is more government 😂

Ok, so why would a fully qualified Army Medic is authorized to treat fellow soldiers while in the military, but it is illegal to do so one day after discharge? Did they suddenly become unqualified or is there a justification that has nothing to do with qualifications?

If a nurse is off duty, it is illegal for them to put stitches in someone’s arm? How is being off duty impacting their qualifications?

70% tax does not equal cheaper healthcare.

No, it’s an industry comprised of many different products and services. You have the right to provide or purchase it uninhibited as with anything else, but no right to obtain it forcibly from others.

To me a Right is something that you are legally allowed to do or get. Not that it has to be given to you.

I believe a country must have a healthcare apparatus in place to medically facilitate its population regardless of their ability to provide their own payment for services.

Most developed countries have that in some capacity.

The issue I have in “Healthcare as a right” is its never clearly defined. And if it is to be defined, to what point does the managing authority draw the line? If your sick and dying its an easy answer, you are provided care. But do we limit some care? Say you have <10% chance of surviving a cancer, should you be given care that is very expensive? Should Cyborgs like myself be included in “healthcare”? Should we all get the newest best computerized limbs regardless of our activity level? [off topic, I am currently walking around on the newest best knee and it costs almost $90k 🤣] To what degree are we treating mental health? If a person is 600lbs should we pay for them to stay in a metabolic ward until they are healthy? Are we fully covering Rx’s?

You should have the right to get healthcare from an unlicensed source. You should have the right to import medications from other countries. You should have the right to practice medicine without a license.

These would all make healthcare cheaper.

There is no “should be.” That’s what it is. You can say that gravity should push things up rather than pull them down, but it would be a silly and worthless discussion.

No to your question. Calling the police is a separate and unrelated thing to claiming you have a right to anyone else’s services.

Countries determine the right of its citizens. So, we choose. A better question would be, SHOULD healthcare be a right. The American people, for whatever reason, seem to think that answer is “no.” Personally, I disagree.

I'm not making any excuses. I'm just the messenger. You are the equivalent of a flat earther when it comes to your understanding of economics and human motives.

People with your cavemen understanding of economics, with the damage caused by their ignorance compounded by the belief that the government is the solution to everything, are completely at fault.

And either way, you’ll have to refer to something other than “healthcare” as that is an industry comprised of many different products and services. You’ll have to state which one(s) specifically you have a right to force others to provide for you.

There is a difference between what is moral and what is a right.

You should have the right to get healthcare from an unlicensed source. You should have the right to import medications from other countries. You should have the right to practice medicine without a license.

These would all make healthcare cheaper.

Rights don’t come from government.

For clarity Im not saying I dont think ppl should get healthcare. If I had a magic wand for universal healthcare that worked perfectly, Id wave it.

To a degree Im playing devil’s advocate, bc every time this topic comes up it devolves into everything is free vs the current system and I dont think either work.

I will give you the right to access healthcare without any discrimination.

The issue is that your rights were taken from you to prop up the medical monopoly.

There is absolutely no valid reason that it is illegal for a trained professional to put stitches into a clean cut, but it is illegal.

There is absolutely no valid reason that someone can’t bring medication into the US from other first world countries, but it is illegal.

There is absolutely no valid reason that a trained medic can help people while in the military, but helping the exact same members out of the military is illegal.

Looks like AI

My second post was not a response to you, you just happen to respond while I was typing it.

I dont disagree with you in theory.

I think allowing unlicensed individuals render care may open the door to ppl being taken advantage of or excluded from receiving formal care if the initial care is botched…but ultimately I side on personal freedom, and if someone wants to go to someone outside of the traditional system, they should be free to do so.

Medicare isn’t free. I have a portion deducted from my social security to help cover it. And, for people without working credits, they would have to completely pay for Medicare.

Yet you have a right to police services.



And do you think industries exist in nature, like gravity? You think the moon has industry? Or mars?

Buck, licenses exist to ensure that people practicing medicine actually know what they are doing.

Great points

Just a couple of facts for you to ponder

We pay twice as much for healthcare as other comparable countries in the world.

Let me repeat that. We pay double what other comparable nations pay for healthcare.

And yet, our life expectancy is 4 years shorter than other comparable countries.

Let me repeat that. Our lives are cut short by 4 years compared to other comparable nations in the world.

Put everything else aside.

We have screwed the pooch when it comes to healthcare in America.

You also don't take into account that universal healthcare did not reduce overall healthcare expenditures in other countries. It severely increased healthcare spending in those countries as well, and those countries didn't even suffer from all of America's additional problems. If we had government forced universal healthcare, it would 100% cause less medical freedom, plus a combination of shortages and even more increases to medical expenses.

You gotta love Americans

We pay double

We die sooner

And, we make excuses for ourselves

It’s no wonder the rest of the world just laughs at our stupidity.

It's a service, but the government can still provide it and it's fair/reasonable to have the opinion that they should even if you don't ascribe to it being a "human right" in some philosophical positive/negative rights sense

And why would the government prevent civilians from purchasing medication from other first world countries? How is that related to qualifications?

It seems to me the common justification is money, not skill.

Healthcare itself is not a right. Equal access to health care s a right.

the leftist is ass ugly and the conservative is gorgeous. art reflects reality.

www.citizen.org/news/fact-check-medicare-for-all-would-save-the-u-s-trillions-public-option-would-leave-millions-uninsured-not-garner-savings/

Proof our healthcare is shit when you can confidently compare your mother to the health care system

Not in the sense that everyone must be given it and all that, but I’d say being able to get decent healthcare without breaking the bank and putting yourself under mountains of debt at the very least should be.

So the license is not foolproof. What neither of us knows is if the risk would increase more than the current financial risk that prevents some from receiving any care at all.

I want to say yes, but I don’t think people should be forced to pay for other people’s bad habits.